[Danielle Brown]

Yes, they can be annoying, but I understand why they are doing it. Bethesda has a history of leaving their games for the PS3 broken. They wave a new shiny game at everyone, promote it heavily on their blog, and then everyone forgets about the previous, broken title. PS3 players get so enamored over the new game they immediately go sign up for pre-release and wait in line for the midnight release. Still, forgetting that they just spent money on a game that doesn't work. Fallout: New Vegas is flat out unplayable, especially if one downloaded any DLC. Bethesda knew this, but waved Skyrim at everyone, blew up video game blogs and websites with trailers and an ad campaign I have not seen the likes of in years. People completely forgot about Fallout: New Vegas and it's problems and lined up in droves to buy Skyrim, just to have the same experience all over again.

No offense, but the example you have described it completely the customer's fault. You are suggesting that people have prior difficulties with bethesda games, but turn a blind eye to their own experiences and repeat their mistakes. Sorry, but wanting to play a video game is not a justification for ignoring common sense and good consumer decision making.

If you genuinely believe that Bethesda struggles with the PS3 platform, as you have suggested them having a "history" of, then it is YOUR responsibility as a consumer to make an informed decision. Saying you are repeating a mistake because you hope someone else will solve the problem just makes you look negligent or incompetent. The problem may or may not be fixed, but every consumer is responsible for making their own informed purchasing decisions.

[leni]

i wouldnt even mind if say hearthfire came out before dawnguard since it seems to be much smaller, which would be easier to fix?

This would be possible if there weren't base code support for Hearthfire written into Dawnguard. Hearthfire won't play if Dawnguard doesn't come first AFAIK.

[ANaIs GRelot]

No offense, but the example you have described it completely the customer's fault. You are suggesting that people have prior difficulties with bethesda games, but turn a blind eye to their own experiences and repeat their mistakes. Sorry, but wanting to play a video game is not a justification for ignoring common sense and good consumer decision making.

If you genuinely believe that Bethesda struggles with the PS3 platform, as you have suggested them having a "history" of, then it is YOUR responsibility as a consumer to make an informed decision. Saying you are repeating a mistake because you hope someone else will solve the problem just makes you look negligent or incompetent. The problem may or may not be fixed, but every consumer is responsible for making their own informed purchasing decisions.

Right, I completely take responsiblity for buying Fallout 3, and then Fallout: New Vegas after finding out about Oblivion. That is all on me, my oops. With Skyrim, however, it is different. Bethesda came out and blatantly lied about it's performance on the PS3. We all read Pete Hines statements about the "completely new engine, quicker bug fixes, and the special attention the PS3 console is getting to put it on a level of parity with other consoles." The purchase of Skyrim is because I believed the lies. I guess some of the blame could be on me for believing them, but most of the blame is on Bethesda for this one. The way Bethesda treated PS3 users with the release of Skyrim is the reason most industries must follow federal laws that punish companies for fraudulent advertising and knowingly and willfully misleading customers into purchasing a defective product.

[Danny Warner]

No offense, but the example you have described it completely the customer's fault. You are suggesting that people have prior difficulties with bethesda games, but turn a blind eye to their own experiences and repeat their mistakes. Sorry, but wanting to play a video game is not a justification for ignoring common sense and good consumer decision making.

If you genuinely believe that Bethesda struggles with the PS3 platform, as you have suggested them having a "history" of, then it is YOUR responsibility as a consumer to make an informed decision. Saying you are repeating a mistake because you hope someone else will solve the problem just makes you look negligent or incompetent. The problem may or may not be fixed, but every consumer is responsible for making their own informed purchasing decisions.

This sounds reasonable, but is unfortunately not accurate. By presenting their product as fully functional on the PS3, Bethesda enters into an agreement of implied warranty with the customer. Regardless of prior history, which cannot be assumed knowledge on the part of any or all consumers (which, in this case, is a moot point due to Bethesda's own, unprompted pre-release statement regarding Skyrim on PS3).

If their product does not work as described, they, and only they are liable.

There are plenty of brands and manufacturers with sordid pasts - but this does not allow them to engage in bait and switch or non-disclaimed "as-is" sales practices.

Your argument would be better served in defending Bethesda against attacks on the quality of the base game. In regards to DLC: you cannot simply say "well, we were gonna" and expect that to be okay. If you bought a computer with a, say, certain graphics card being advertised as coming pre-installed, but when the computer was delivered, the card was missing, would that be your fault? Let's say the computer company said "well, we didn't realize how incompatible these two items are, but we're working on it. No ETA, and it's not like you bought the CPU just for the card..." Your fault, too?

I just fail to understand how commenters - many of whom are obviously unaffected by this situation - continue to try to shift blame away from Bethesda - or turn this into some sort of greater, moral debate. The facts are plain and simple: each PS3 disc is currently defective, per it's described purpose. It is solely the responsibility of Bethesda to remedy this, or face the consequences - which extend beyond simply "losing customers." This is where the past examples also fail: at the very least, promised product features were delivered for prior games. Performance issues notwithstanding, to promise something and not deliver it - as a manufacturer - leaves you, and you alone, liable.

[Alexandra walker]

This would be possible if there weren't base code support for Hearthfire written into Dawnguard. Hearthfire won't play if Dawnguard doesn't come first AFAIK.

So does that mean you're required to buy all of the DLCs in order to play the one you want? That'd be pretty diabolical...

We have the "Dawnguard Prep Patch" (minus trophies, and probably some other things) so wouldn't that facilitate Hearthfire, considering there wasn't a Hearthfire patch?

[Jonathan Montero]

snip

Hey, I was responding to the specific example the poster made, in which the customer clearly had prior issues with the PS3 platform playing Bethesda games. I'm not defending Bethesda either, I just think it is absurd for someone to say "I got burned repeatedly in the past and keep getting burned because I keep repeating the same decision, but that is your fault, not mine."

If you want to discuss other topics like DLC or platforms, go ahead, but I was specifically responding to an absurd post that seems devoid of the most basic common sense or consumer responsibility.

[lacy lake]

So does that mean you're required to buy all of the DLCs in order to play the one you want? That'd be pretty diabolical...

We have the "Dawnguard Prep Patch" (minus trophies, and probably some other things) so wouldn't that facilitate Hearthfire, considering there wasn't a Hearthfire patch?

Like I said, as far as I know. I could very easily be vastly mistaken, which is an equal percentage chance at this point.

[Marquis T]

Hey, I was responding to the specific example the poster made, in which the customer clearly had prior issues with the PS3 platform playing Bethesda games. I'm not defending Bethesda either, I just think it is absurd for someone to say "I got burned repeatedly in the past and keep getting burned because I keep repeating the same decision, but that is your fault, not mine."

If you want to discuss other topics like DLC or platforms, go ahead, but I was specifically responding to an absurd post that seems devoid of the most basic common sense or consumer responsibility.

Understood - and I don't mean to start any arguments here.

The fact does remain that 1. It is still Bethesda's liability, as they are not delivering a product consistent with its description, and 2. this is, in fact, a separate issue. In the past, product elements have been delivered as promised, it's just that their quality was "lacking." In this case, we have a defective product.

I do agree that customers should exercise discretion - especially when past history is so evident. However, like myself, there are many to whom Skyrim was a first encounter with both TES and Bethesda. So while it is absolutely understandable - and advisable - for customers to look elsewhere in the future, it does not place the reponsibility of promised product delivery on the consumer.

I do not see this as ending with a "we tried, sorry." Either the product will be delivered, or Bethesda will be held liable for any of a number of consumer protection violations.

Personally - and like just about everyone else - I just want the product I purchased, and before people start bringing up "you didn't PURCHASE the DLC" - I was told I was purchasing a product that would allow me to.

That's the issue here, and I believe, it's also the hold up. For those who think it's unrealistic that Bethesda may be working on recoding the game - ground up - to run as advertised on PS3, I would point out that it may be much less costly than the alternative they are facing. The delay is in determining which will be less costly.

[Eilidh Brian]

Hey, I was responding to the specific example the poster made, in which the customer clearly had prior issues with the PS3 platform playing Bethesda games. I'm not defending Bethesda either, I just think it is absurd for someone to say "I got burned repeatedly in the past and keep getting burned because I keep repeating the same decision, but that is your fault, not mine."

If you want to discuss other topics like DLC or platforms, go ahead, but I was specifically responding to an absurd post that seems devoid of the most basic common sense or consumer responsibility.

If you would have read my follow up, you will see that as far as Skyrim goes it was the lies told by Bethesda that were the reason behind my purchase of Skyrim. My post was not absurd as you claim. Also, insinuating that I have no common sense or consumer responsibility is also a non point and untrue. There is a reason why there are penalties and federal laws against fraudulent advertising. I do wonder why the video game industry does not have to abide by those laws, but that is a different topic and a digression.

If you bought a computer that advertised 16gb of ram, but found it only had 2gb of ram when you brought it home would it be your fault? Would it be your fault if the computer company advertised that the computer had a video card capable of playing the latest games, yet you find out it can barely handle pong? Would you respond well when someone told you "you bought it, you should have known better?" No, you would be upset and have every right to be. If you were like the rest of the US, you would take the computer back to the store and get a full refund, and perhaps sue the computer manufacturer for fraudulent advertising. Well, in this situation we cannot sue Bethesda for anything and if we return the game we will receive less than half of what we paid for it. For some, they would get less than 25%.
Now do you understand where the anger comes from? Like I said, the Fallout games were my fault. But with Skyrim, I trusted Bethesda when they promised it would be better. That is solely Bethesda's fault.

[Rebekah Rebekah Nicole]

Understood - and I don't mean to start any arguments here.

The fact does remain that 1. It is still Bethesda's liability, as they are not delivering a product consistent with its description, and 2. this is, in fact, a separate issue. In the past, product elements have been delivered as promised, it's just that their quality was "lacking." In this case, we have a defective product.

I do agree that customers should exercise discretion - especially when past history is so evident. However, like myself, there are many to whom Skyrim was a first encounter with both TES and Bethesda. So while it is absolutely understandable - and advisable - for customers to look elsewhere in the future, it does not place the reponsibility of promised product delivery on the consumer.

I do not see this as ending with a "we tried, sorry." Either the product will be delivered, or Bethesda will be held liable for any of a number of consumer protection violations.

Personally - and like just about everyone else - I just want the product I purchased, and before people start bringing up "you didn't PURCHASE the DLC" - I was told I was purchasing a product that would allow me to.

That's the issue here, and I believe, it's also the hold up. For those who think it's unrealistic that Bethesda may be working on recoding the game - ground up - to run as advertised on PS3, I would point out that it may be much less costly than the alternative they are facing. The delay is in determining which will be less costly.

Another thing that kind of bugs me is that the 360 version gets full 1080p and the PS3 version only does 720p.

[OJY]

Yes i am quite sad about the fact we may not get DLC. however don't think about what we didnt get from beth, think about what we did


SKYRIM bethesda

[-__^]

Yes i am quite sad about the fact we may not get DLC. however don't think about what we didnt get from beth, think about what we did


SKYRIM bethesda

I wonder if you would be that happy if someone gave everyone $1,000 dollars and they gave only you a quarter, and that quarter didn't even work in any vending machines.

[Abel Vazquez]

So does that mean you're required to buy all of the DLCs in order to play the one you want? That'd be pretty diabolical...

We have the "Dawnguard Prep Patch" (minus trophies, and probably some other things) so wouldn't that facilitate Hearthfire, considering there wasn't a Hearthfire patch?

Lots of Xbox and PC players did not buy Dawnguard, but did buy Hearthfire, they had no problems playing anything. DLC is optional you do not have to buy both. Bethesda would already have both DLC's working, they only need to find the solution to whatever is holding up the release. It would probably take as long to fix either DLC so I doubt they would released Hearthfire first for the PS3.

[Rudi Carter]

After reading other posts, I freely admit I was wrong. Sorry if I mislead anyone.

[Lisa Robb]

Since both DLCs havent been released on PS3, but they have been released on all other platforms, this makes me agrivated, but I still have hope in Bethesda!!

[Jade Barnes-Mackey]

Do we really need another topic about ps3 DLC , we all know that it will be the same thing with this DLC, really people just go to the dawnguard forum and there talk about this, there is no reason to make another topic at least untill dawnguard be realesed, if it will be, so please, lets not make another topic just so we can flame and moan.

[Luis Reyma]

Do we really need another topic about ps3 DLC , we all know that it will be the same thing with this DLC, really people just go to the dawnguard forum and there talk about this, there is no reason to make another topic at least untill dawnguard be realesed, if it will be, so please, lets not make another topic just so we can flame and moan.

Better a dedicated thread here than people constantly starting new ones.

[Spooky Angel]

Do we really need another topic about ps3 DLC , we all know that it will be the same thing with this DLC, really people just go to the dawnguard forum and there talk about this, there is no reason to make another topic at least untill dawnguard be realesed, if it will be, so please, lets not make another topic just so we can flame and moan.

if you dont like this topic dont read it.

[Laura Simmonds]

From what I hear, they are taking responsibility for the issue, and working with Sony to resolve it. At this point, all that we can reasonably ask of them, they are doing.

I think its reasonable to ask for an apology.

[Darrell Fawcett]

If they don't fix the problem, and we PS3 users have to do without DLC, I feel we're entitled to more than that.

[Lizs]

I think its reasonable to ask for an apology.

Given the only two forms an apology could take are: "Sorry, we can't be bothered" which would cause outrage and demands for redress from PS3 customers; and "Sorry, the PS3 is way too complicated to develop for" which would cause outrage and almost certain litigation from Sony, I suspect they will continue to do the corporate P.R. equivalent of hiding under their bedcovers.

Best hope is they will continue working in silence on the issue in the hopes of avoiding either. Careful what you wish for, an apology would almost certainly be the end.

[Vahpie]

Another thing that kind of bugs me is that the 360 version gets full 1080p and the PS3 version only does 720p.

Very, very few games are 1080p on consoles. Skyrim is not one of them. It's 720p at most on both the Xbox and PS3 as trying to run at a full HD resolution would murder frame rates.

[Roy Harris]

Very, very few games are 1080p on consoles. Skyrim is not one of them. It's 720p at most on both the Xbox and PS3 as trying to run at a full HD resolution would murder frame rates.

Oddly enough, I imagine 1080 on the PS3 would have been the more technically feasible of the two. The disadvantage of having much of the working memory sectioned-off in a dedicated more powerful GPU, while apparently making expansions more difficult (for Beth. at least), would probably have made comparatively better graphics easier (had they bothered to code for same).

I'm thinking the stick the PS3 got was short at both ends.

[Floor Punch]

I thought that Bethesda announced that Hearthfire wasn't going to be released on PS3, but hopefully it does

[P PoLlo]

I wonder if you would be that happy if someone gave everyone $1,000 dollars and they gave only you a quarter, and that quarter didn't even work in any vending machines.

you can doubt my happiness in what i have. but i know my place and what i want from life, i have everything to gain from not being a pessimist.