worked fine in fallout, maybe you justhavent played fallout

Yeah it did, superb in fact, but I wouldnt want headshots in Skyrim. Limb damage would of been excellent though.

I do not agree that Skyrim's combat is terrible without hit detection but it would be a lot better with a limited hit detection feature, Seems like a no-brainer to me & it's a bit bewildering as to why people would not want such a feature implemented if it was done properly.

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I've been saying it for years but no one listens.

Unfortunately for you, Bethesda will not change the combat system just to suit your needs.

I have never been bothered by Skyrim combat for the most part. It isn't perfect, but I don't have any real issues with it.

Maybe quoting out of context, but i just love this argument. Why improve something in a new game? It was already bad in the previous installments. Ambition is for losers.

Already addressed that if you read my other post. To do it they would have to bring in locational damage, which I highly doubt they will ever do in ES, at least for the time being.

i was thinking of saying something similar.

I, too, don't see how this can be an argument. Why would having locational damage be a bad thing? What is wrong with having a hit to the head do more damage than a hit to the foot? It makes combat more interesting, more tactical, and just more fun. It wouldn't even drastically change combat mechanics, it would just be a small addition to what is already there.

And as mentioned, it wouldn't be too difficult to implement as it was present in Fallout 3, and Skyrim's engine is just an upgraded version of what was used in that game.

Play Dead Island. Every hit counts. And it hurts. They do stagger when you hit them.

Don't be ridiculous. Not hit detection? Play games like dragon age and mmos and then say that. The arrows even stick in where they hit. You seem to be asking for locational damage which I'm pretty sure they left out intentionally.

I don't much see the point either, this isn't VATS, just aim at the centre. They could make leg shots do even LESS damage, but that seems to be the oposite of what you're asking. It's an RPG, the game mechanics wouldn't allow a level 1 to instantly cripple someone.

Not saying the combat system's perfect either, yeah more animations reacting to hits might be nice.

In terms of the topic, it's a good idea, it really is. If you look at the way combat has advanced from Morrowind, then you'll see why so many people have leapt to defend skyrims combat. I imagine this idea is on the drawing board, and if Beth can fit it in, then they would. However, in immersion terms there's probably a tonne of other stuff higher up the list than this. I'd imagine whatever caused that horse and rider I witnessed yesterday to take off vertically, circle around falkreath a couple of times before flying off southwards whilst facing east might be a little higher up the list with regards to improving immersion. It's worth throwing the idea out there though.

The only good reason to implement locational damage with Skyrim as-is would be for archery. Like I've said before, Skyrim's melee combat isn't designed around precision aiming so it would be pointless in that spectrum.


You're being a bit naive. Bethesda at this point isn't interested in vastly improving combat. It seems to me that they're interested in adding superfluous kill-cam moves instead of adding something meaningful to Skyrim's combat. I have no doubt in my mind that the animation work that they spent on all those useless fluff kill-cam moves would have been time better spent making Skyrim's combat actually better.

Kill-cam moves add nothing to Skyrim's combat but meaningless instant gratification that gets repetitive very quickly and it doesn't even add depth or complexity to the system. But hey, that appears to be their focus for whatever reason.

He's talking about better physics and ragdolling - the game "detecting hits" and applying appropriate force & behaviors to the target (hit in the shoulder, shoulder goes back, torso twists to that side, etc). Mostly cosmetic, unless you also add in locational damage, so that the enemy is then reduced in capability with that arm.

Having grown up with games, over the decades, that don't do this, I don't really see it as a big deal. I also wonder that it would make TES even more of an "action game". And/or take up resources that could be used for other features (since the TES games have so many features; unlike, say, an MMA fighting game that can spend lots of it's budget and programming on just making "fighting" more real/complex/overdone/etc.)


edit: there's also the part where it's "only fair" for a system like that to effect the player as well - and honestly, being constantly knocked around/stunned/thrown off target/etc is beyond aggravating. Heck, the constant stagger from fighting Ogres or Trolls in Oblivion was bad enough - definitely wouldn't want to see a more robust system than that effecting the player. I can just picture the nausea from the camera view being juggled around so chaotically.

Yeah, wouldn't want to take up Bethesda's precious kill-cam time. Go-go-go more kill-cam moves please!

Having a better combat system wouldn't make TES even more of an "action game." Doing a complete 180 and changing it's play-style to that of a game like Kingdoms of Amalur and disabling first person would make TES more of an "action game." There's quite a huge difference between the two examples in any case.

Doesn't make much sense to me. Lets hold back TES' combat system because people are afraid of certain labels that don't mean anything in the grand scheme of things.

Skyrim is the most action oriented TES game I've played. Why not improve upon combat since there is such focus on it in this iteration?
It's strange how a few vehemently oppose this suggestion, with reasons like, "TES hasn't had this before." It's as if they have a hidden agenda. So weird. Not weird that they disagree, but weird how emotional they seem.

They did improve combat... have you not seen the new kill-cam moves? So sweet!...

Yes because killcams are all theyve added into combat. They haven't added dual wield, shield bashing, the slow mo triggered by enemy power attacks, or made hitting an enemy actual feel more tangible than it did in oblivion have they? And thats just a few of the changes that have been made, and they sound reasonably meaningful to me.

Play Morrowind if you haven't already, see how much improvement combat has seen over just 2 games after that one. As a whole, very good progress has been, and is being, made.

I kinda wish New Vegas hadn't come out a year before Skyrim, I also kinda wish I hadn't busted my Morrowind cherry in the meantime, as much as I love Skyrim I know that it's missing the final 5%, the bit that pushes you over the edge and into a genuine connection with the story, maybe it's because lots of the old timers have moved on from Bethesda, it's stands out to me because they got the world and lore so damn right, I love the civil war and the return of the Thalmor, the dragons too, I just don't feel like many of the stories play out in a satisfying way.


All that being said, if Skyrim was my first time with an open world RPG I'd have nothing but praise for it, I can't dislike a game I've put hundreds of hours into

When have I stated that progress hasn't been made? Yes it's better than Oblivion's combat, but lets not put it on a pedestal, shall we? Did the patch 1.5 not add new kill-cam moves? Honestly, I think kill-cam moves, both the ones added in patch 1.5 and the ones that came with the vanilla game, are stupid and meaningless. Furthermore, Bethesda adding more kill-cam moves with patch 1.5 just goes to show where their mindset is in regards to combat.

They don't really seem to care about improving it all that much. They don't care for complexity or depth. Like I said before, yes, it's an improvement over Oblivion's combat but that isn't saying much. Oblivion's combat wasn't that great. Does Skyrim's combat fit with the TES series? To some extent, yeah. Am I happy about the whole kill-cam direction they seem to be going in? Not at all.

And for your information, I've played Daggerfall, Morrowind (All expansions included), Oblivion (All DLC included), and of course, Skyrim. Lets not get elitist by pulling the Morrowind card. (Waits for someone to pull the Arena card and possible Battlespire [lol?] card)

Just read the first page, if I am repeating something feel free to ignore this post.

Health on pc and npcs is meant to show how combat works. Hit in the head with a sword, bow, fireball would kill anyone no matter what. Hitpoints show you dodging, parrying ect. Basically the more hitpoints the more combat training you have to allow for the back and forth of the battle.

When they started showing arrows in bodies they should have shown them mitigated by armor and not sticking out of our or an enemies eye.

Locational dmg is a great concept and if done like fallout would be cool but they would have to do alot of work. Undead wouldnt be staggered or limp if hit as they dont feel pain for example. They would also need to make those like a called shot so to speak and have either penalties to hit and or penalties to your defense after such a move or give health pools to each body part. They also would have to do alot more animations and control of your weapons to swing at different parts.


All in all a decent idea but I personally would not want this implemented as I play this for an rpg fix, not a fps fix.

They didn't really have a problem doing animations for superfluous kill-cam moves, did they?

dual wielding weapons is broken. there should be more incentive in altering between left and right weapons instead of spamming the right. also the power attack (even though its powerful) is static and the enemy moving back leaves you open, unless you just tap it.

Right, let's look at it this way: skyrims early days have been horribly plagued with bugs. There have also been myriad requests for upgrades, some easily implemented, others not so much. Never mind the time constraints on them from sorting out the bigger bugs, can you imagine the outcry if they gaffed again and had to redo another patch? I couldn't blame them for being somewhat loath to alter the games coding TOO much.

As well, if im coming across as a little spiky, I do apologise, but nowhere in your post did you acknowledge progress being made; much as I'd like to be I'm not a mindreader. In context I'd say skyrim has the best combat of any TES game to date. I think this is a good idea, although sadly not one we'll see in skyrim. Next time round localised damage reactions, mounted combat and the return of polearms should be on beths 'to do' list.