If Khajiit aren't allowed in the cities...

Post » Mon Jun 04, 2012 7:33 pm

Why would Bethesda allow the players to chose a race that could not complete any guilds or the main quest because they are banned from all the cities?

Being able to play guilds and main quest as Khajiit > Forcing all players of khajiit to stay outside in Skyrim and not be able to complete the game
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Laura Richards
 
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Post » Mon Jun 04, 2012 7:29 am

Only the caravaners say they are not allowed in the cities, it isn't said or implied by anyone else.

I figure it means they aren't allowed to sell their wares in the cities, not that they are completely barred from entering.

Indeed, and if you look at what they're selling there might be a good reason why they aren't allowed in. Moon sugar, lots and lots of lockpicks.
They act innocent enough, but that might just that, an act.
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WYatt REed
 
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Post » Mon Jun 04, 2012 1:39 pm

Did anyone say laziness yet? Anyone?

That's why. Laziness.
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Heather beauchamp
 
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Post » Mon Jun 04, 2012 9:37 pm

I'm pretty sure it's just the Khajiit merchants that are not allowed in the cities... you know, selling Skooma and all that.
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chinadoll
 
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Post » Mon Jun 04, 2012 7:46 am

Because it's a game and games are supposed to be fun. Yes, you might think that it lacks in realism but it's the first rule of gamedesign. Make it fun.




That is just ignorant.

Wouldnt it be more fun if the race you chose (each with its own place in the lore of the game world) actually impacted your gameplay. Choosing an Argonian, Khajit or Darkelf should subject you to the same brutal racism you see the NPCs suffering from. Its too weird that my Darkelf Murderer can just stroll into Ulfrics castle and start chatting him up.
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Destinyscharm
 
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Post » Mon Jun 04, 2012 11:05 am

Only the caravaners say they are not allowed in the cities, it isn't said or implied by anyone else.

I figure it means they aren't allowed to sell their wares in the cities, not that they are completely barred from entering.

This, only the caravaners speak of this.

The Jarls already have vendors in their holds, who [censored] and moan incessantly already about the Dragonborne flooding their markets with iron daggers. So outsiders, who lick their butts, strolll up to the main gate and want let in. These vendors will sell stuff, aquire septims from the townsfolk, and then mosey on down the road. That's another big issue. Those septims go into the caravaners pockets, where the Jarl can't tax it.

But most importantly, the OP is asking gamesas to impletement barriers to the player simply because of a race choice. Arbitrary barriers from seemingly inconsequential, at the time, choices is the hallmark of poor game design.

Why are Khajiiti player characters allowed into the cities without any hassle? Really simple answer to that question, because that Khajiiti is being controlled by the player.
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latrina
 
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Post » Mon Jun 04, 2012 8:08 am

The right way would have been requiring quests to raise your faction before you could enter. The quests would be available for everyone, but would be required for the undesirable races.
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MR.BIGG
 
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Post » Mon Jun 04, 2012 7:26 pm

Why would Bethesda allow the players to chose a race that could not complete any guilds or the main quest because they are banned from all the cities?

Being able to play guilds and main quest as Khajiit > Forcing all players of khajiit to stay outside in Skyrim and not be able to complete the game

It doesnt have to be that cut and dry. There could be ways of earning trust with the guards and cities... Gaining a reputation as a hero/sellsword for example.
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Kerri Lee
 
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Post » Mon Jun 04, 2012 9:26 am



But most importantly, the OP is asking gamesas to impletement barriers to the player simply because of a race choice. Arbitrary barriers from seemingly inconsequential, at the time, choices is the hallmark of poor game design.

Why are Khajiiti player characters allowed into the cities without any hassle? Really simple answer to that question, because that Khajiiti is being controlled by the player.

It wouldnt be arbitrary it'd be part of the game's story.
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W E I R D
 
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Post » Mon Jun 04, 2012 12:19 pm

Because it's a game and games are supposed to be fun. Yes, you might think that it lacks in realism but it's the first rule of gamedesign. Make it fun.

No, it's just laziness. Go play Vampire The Masquerade: Bloodlines. If you choose to play as either a Nosferatu or a Malkavian it completely changes the game play from the other clans. Nosferatu are forced to travel about the sewers because just being seen by a human is a masquerade violation, and Malkavians have their entire dialogue changed and both are treated very differently then if you picked Brujah or any of the other clans. Guess what, that made it uber fun to play as those clans, and it gave you a real reason to want to replay the game as them.
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jennie xhx
 
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Post » Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:58 pm

There was one Khajiit I met in Riften after the Diplomatic Immunity quest. Even though she has a reason to be there, it's not known to everyone else, yet she roams the streets without anyone giving a damn.
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Carlos Vazquez
 
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Post » Mon Jun 04, 2012 10:52 am

If they want NPC races to be treated differently then that HAS to be reflected in the player as well. I'm not saying drastically change the game, but make it noticeably different. Easier in some ways, harder in others. Your khajiit should have to do a small quest to be accepted into the cities, and maybe get some papers proving they're allowed in. As a plus, they should get discounts with the trade caravans. The game is just much more fun when your character actually feels different. I remember how the original dragon age did that, and how fallout does that, only with different perks and karma as opposed to different races. It just makes the game more immersive. I hate how people will be talking about a certain race and not even acknowledge the fact that you're the race they're talking about, like the thalmor in Markarth explaining to my bosmer what a bosmer is. Laziness. You can't say it would take too much dialogue or we don't have the technology to change this, becsuse as I said dragon age and Fallout, both older games, one by bethesda, have already done this relatively well.
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Jacob Phillips
 
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Post » Mon Jun 04, 2012 10:21 am

All these legitimate complaints that people jump all over with ridicule but ones like this...

Just :shakehead:
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jess hughes
 
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Post » Mon Jun 04, 2012 1:44 pm

I have a game as a Khajiit and I haven't done any of the main quest, there is no way of anyone knowing I am Dragonborn.

Keep playing without touching the main quest, you will find NPCs refer to you as, "dragonborn".
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Rachel Tyson
 
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Post » Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:04 pm

Keep playing without touching the main quest, you will find NPCs refer to you as, "dragonborn".
Not for my Thief/DB and monk characters.
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:)Colleenn
 
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Post » Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:44 pm

Double post
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Miguel
 
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Post » Mon Jun 04, 2012 12:54 pm



But didn't the Dunmer enslave the beast races at the time? Yet you could play an Argonian and walk around like a champion.

Like Exodiom Plus just posted - "Its nothing new".

The fact is that the main quest has always been primarily built around the default player. The additional race choice is just an Bethesda extra to add a greater depth to the game.

But in Morrowind, they did their best to clearly explain why beast races could join the great houses and be treared equally if they were free. There were whole books on the subject
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Spooky Angel
 
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Post » Mon Jun 04, 2012 9:27 pm

It is just laziness. Aside from a few exceptions, everyone treats you the same as if you were a Nord.


Very true... if they decided a story element is Khajiit cannot enter cites then they should have accounted for it in their story...or just not made that rule.

In the conference room while making the game someone should have said, "Hey, were saying Khajiit cannot enter cities but if the main charter is that race they can...that makes no sense so let’s just remove that story element so we don't look ridiculous."

Then someone should have said, "You're right, lets remove that meaningless, easily broken story element so we don't look like incompetent fools."

But nobody said that, and now Bethesda looks stupid. Yet, was there any lack of proof for that assertion give then poor game design throughout? Just add that to the pile of errors, it a huge pile and hard to miss.
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Andrea P
 
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Post » Mon Jun 04, 2012 1:55 pm

That are all so minor things...really... It would be a cool game if you run straight to Whiterun and see some Paper on the Gate "We have to wait outside!" with some pictures of Argonian, Khajiit, Darkelfes or other races.
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Nikki Morse
 
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Post » Mon Jun 04, 2012 2:45 pm

That are all so minor things...really... It would be a cool game if you run straight to Whiterun and see some Paper on the Gate "We have to wait outside!" with some pictures of Argonian, Khajiit, Darkelfes or other races.

As stated before, they could have either removed that story elemet, or made all the races feel different like they do in other games. They could have made it a little quest to prove to the guards you can enter the city, and they'd give you papers that let you enter any city. Other races would have little perks and drawbacks as well, to really give you the feel that you ARE this race, not just a nord wearing a cat costume.
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Honey Suckle
 
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Post » Mon Jun 04, 2012 11:38 am

Well they call my Character "Cat", "Khajiit" all the time, so the feeling is there that my Character is not a Nord.
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suniti
 
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Post » Mon Jun 04, 2012 8:15 am

Because if they didnt...the forums would be flooded with posts of "I can't play this game as a khajiit....It's borken!1!!1!!!!"
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Jennie Skeletons
 
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Post » Mon Jun 04, 2012 1:29 pm

I thought that it was more the fact that they can't actualy trade or settle in the city's and if I stay in the same place too long I keep getting called a Milk Drinker haha
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Mr.Broom30
 
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Post » Mon Jun 04, 2012 6:10 pm

It wouldnt be arbitrary it'd be part of the game's story.

It would only be part of story if your main character was part of that Khajiiti caravan, and everyone all but knew you were selling Skooma and Moonsugar. Did you miss that part? It was quoted in my post that you quoted. Only the caravaners complain about not being let into the city. Quite a few of the cities have Khajiiti in them.
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Spencey!
 
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Post » Mon Jun 04, 2012 9:55 pm

This may have been said already but they are barred from SELLING in the city. They are discriminated against so they choose not to go in. So tey peddle their drugs outside so the law doesn't come down on them. All khajits are merchants in skyrim or thieves. Don't expect them to be welcome in places. The guards always say they will keep an eye on you. Hell. I was a nord and I couldn't get into Whiterun until I had urgent news for the Jarl.....
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Aman Bhattal
 
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