Rant of the casual gamer! : V - Skyrim

» Thu Jun 07, 2012 2:02 pm

Sad days. In the rain ...
I'm not going to be happy again OP.

» Fri Jun 08, 2012 1:50 am

I have an idea, that I think the hardcoe and casuals will like. For the next TES, they should make two games, one for casuals and one for hardcoe fans.The casual friendly one, will have a lot of the depth taken out, features will be taken out, and the quests and story will be subpar, but will have fluff and be pretty to keep them entertained. While the hardcoe game, will have a lot of depth, a lot of good content, and thrilling quests and story to keep them entertained. It would be easy to do, since its the same game, but modifed slightly.

No...the difference in the two versions would be that the casual version involves quests and mechanics that drives the story and character development forward, while the hardcoe version has quests that involve your mother-in-law coming to visit your house so you have to clean it up and features such as pebbles getting into your boots so you have to stop and sit down and remove them every 30 minutes...

» Thu Jun 07, 2012 9:16 pm

Good for you. I'm glad you enjoy the game.

One thing puzzles me about your post though. Why did you start playing TES? These are, or were, sandbox rpgs and as such are generally inferior to many other games in terms of combat and storyline. There are so many games that provide great experiences without the need to invest so much time, why would you seek out a game based on role playing and exploration when you seem to be annoyed by those aspects of the game?

I was wondering this as well and didn't see a response anywhere. I started at Morrowind and it placed emphasis on exploring a world. The combat wasn't great. Oblivion and Skyrim have placed a bit more emphasis on the action. When did the OP get into TES and why, if he doesn't seem to enjoy the sandbox aspects?

» Thu Jun 07, 2012 6:34 pm

No...the difference in the two versions would be that the casual version involves quests and mechanics that drives the story and character development forward, while the hardcoe version has quests that involve your mother-in-law coming to visit your house so you have to clean it up and features such as pebbles getting into your boots so you have to stop and sit down and remove them every 30 minutes...

You mean quests and mechanics, where the game holds your hand on the whole and puts you on rails so you can't fail?

» Thu Jun 07, 2012 10:49 pm

Dang, I enjoy doing everything in game that you knocked down....

» Fri Jun 08, 2012 1:35 am

I was wondering this as well and didn't see a response anywhere. I started at Morrowind and it placed emphasis on exploring a world. The combat wasn't great. Oblivion and Skyrim have placed a bit more emphasis on the action. When did the OP get into TES and why, if he doesn't seem to enjoy the sandbox aspects?

I don′t mind the sandbox aspects, if I had time to invest I might enjoy it...I simply mind elitist people who claim they are the only ones who know how the game is meant to be played. I very clearly said I appreciated all those people who said you can play the game in any way you prefer.

» Thu Jun 07, 2012 3:26 pm

No...the difference in the two versions would be that the casual version involves quests and mechanics that drives the story and character development forward, while the hardcoe version has quests that involve your mother-in-law coming to visit your house so you have to clean it up and features such as pebbles getting into your boots so you have to stop and sit down and remove them every 30 minutes...

Don't forget pooping.

» Fri Jun 08, 2012 2:55 am

You mean quests and mechanics, where the game holds your hand on the whole and puts you on rails so you can't fail?

har har...but I fall off the rails anyway... :dry:

» Fri Jun 08, 2012 12:17 am

Not really, hardcoe mode just includes a few mechanics that support RPers such as myself. Stories and guilds and quests in general need to be altered from what they are now to get more depth in general.

But that's the problem I'm talking about...
Casual vs hardcoe...
Where Casual gamers want to fast travel, to follow quest markers, and etc...
And hardcoe fans don't.

» Thu Jun 07, 2012 1:13 pm

No...the difference in the two versions would be that the casual version involves quests and mechanics that drives the story and character development forward, while the hardcoe version has quests that involve your mother-in-law coming to visit your house so you have to clean it up and features such as pebbles getting into your boots so you have to stop and sit down and remove them every 30 minutes...

» Thu Jun 07, 2012 2:16 pm

see? i just said in one sentence what you said in a wall of text. :tongue:

But he fast travelled so had the time to write all that wall of text

» Thu Jun 07, 2012 7:46 pm

There is a diffrence, between super ultra realstic and hardcoe, but thats too much to comprehend I suppose. I guess for casuals, less good content is more so bad filler could be used instead.

» Thu Jun 07, 2012 10:23 pm

Gandalf eating pancakes and trimming his toenails

Priceless

» Thu Jun 07, 2012 11:03 pm

I'm glad that Bethesda designed it so that casual gamers and hardcoe gamers can enjoy Skyrim. It's a win-win situation.

It is in the best interests of the developer to create a game with a very broad market.

In any case I think the more rounded a game is, the better

» Thu Jun 07, 2012 3:55 pm

One other thing I'd point out:

Just because you are heavily time-limited doesn't mean you can't play the game "hard core" IF you enjoy playing that way.

There's no "Skyrim police" that will come arrest you if you have played the game for a year without yet finishing the main quest.

That's not to say that you should never fast travel or do any of the other time-saving things, if you enjoy doing it that way. I'm just saying don't let your amount of available play time dictate how you will play any more than what someone else says on a forum. Really, the ONLY thing that should be factoring in to how you decide to play this game is your own sense of enjoyment. You shouldn't skip things you like doing just because it will extend the amount of time it takes to finish the game.

One thing I'd like to say about fast travel, too: It doesn't have to be an all or nothing venture. Just because you sometimes fast travel doesn't mean you can't do the actual run from time to time. That's exactly how I play, in fact. I usually fast travel, but occasionally, I'll just decide to hoof it. The same applies in reverse too. Just because you generally like actually running everywhere doesn't mean the roleplay police will come for you if you just don't feel like it one day, and use fast travel. It's nothing to feel guilty about, or be ashamed of. Protip: no one will ever know you did it! If you find yourself putting off certain quests that you'd otherwise be interested in doing, just because you don't feel like running all the way to Riften, then you're probably putting your "no fast travel" rule ahead of your enjoyment, and should consider revising it.

» Thu Jun 07, 2012 10:23 pm

you are completely wrong about not missing anything if you fast travel all the time. if you fast travel all the time you will miss out on many radiant quests that only appear on the way to locations. if you mean you just fast travel because you have been back and forth between a couple of cities a bunch of times selling loot or something i can completely understand that. i do that myself i just use the carriages.

i have only seen one post by someone claiming that their game has improved going from no fast travel to fast travel. on the other hand i have seen numerous topics and posts about people who initially played fast travel and decided to not fast travel and were glad they did and one of the things they all pointed out was that you miss so much of the game when you fast travel everywhere.

if they patch the game and accidently increase the iron bows damage to 100 will you claim that its a game mechanic and if people dont want to one shot everything they should just avoid using iron bows altogether. that is a silly argument and you know it.

» Thu Jun 07, 2012 11:48 pm

I agree with the OP people shouldn't be so elitist about the way they play and there is alot of this on TES forums.

In relation to the game it should be accessible to both casual and hardcoe players. As in If you want to fast travel and use map markers it should be possible but if you don't it should be possible to reach your destination without them.

» Fri Jun 08, 2012 2:51 am

No...the difference in the two versions would be that the casual version involves quests and mechanics that drives the story and character development forward, while the hardcoe version has quests that involve your mother-in-law coming to visit your house so you have to clean it up and features such as pebbles getting into your boots so you have to stop and sit down and remove them every 30 minutes...

You come across as highly ignorant of what a real "hardcoe mode" is with this post, which is in and of itself a straw man argument.

hardcoe modes exist to up the challenge in a realistic fashion so that the people who enjoy playing games really deeply can get immersed into the world that much more. New Vegas did a good job: primary needs, could not heal crippled limbs without special tools, no instant healing, weighted ammo... those kinds of things.

It is not about us wanting to clean up our homes for our mother-in-law's visit. That is not "hardcoe," that is stupid.

These are the people who are doing all the complaining that Skyrim's story arcs were terrible, you know.

» Thu Jun 07, 2012 9:34 pm

I agree with the OP people shouldn't be so elitist about the way they play and there is alot of this on TES forums.

In relation to the game it should be accessible to both casual and hardcoe players. As in If you want to fast travel and use map markers it should be possible but if you don't it should be possible to reach your destination without them.

You are right, but....The default = casual / care for me / I have to run!

My question to you would be: Would you be upset if there was no default at all? You can play the game casually, without the quest markers, if the
quests are designed in a way to make it so you have to follow a certain path, and if you got stuck, then you can use a spell (which is in the game), or in the future, maybe an npc guide? or to ask said npc for "detailed " directions.

Yes, I can switch off the quest markers.......but, the quests are still too easy. Cuz the quest journal will never go away.

Again, I look back at the way games were designed. To use your brain. Quest puzzles......ugh.

The game is easy, and it's immersive. Which one do i like more? Immersive.

Which do i hate the most = easy.

In closing, I will have to be p.c. here (politically correct)......

Would rather have a game that makes me use my brain more + immersion.

» Thu Jun 07, 2012 10:50 pm

You come across as highly ignorant of what a real "hardcoe mode" is with this post.

hardcoe modes exist to up the challenge in a realistic fashion so that the people who enjoy playing games really deeply can get immersed into the world that much more. New Vegas did a good job: primary needs, could not heal crippled limbs without special tools, no instant healing, weighted ammo... those kinds of things.

It is not about us wanting to clean up our homes for our mother-in-law's visit. That is not "hardcoe," that is stupid.

These are the people who are doing all the complaining that Skyrim's story arcs were terrible, you know.

I think they could of improved the hardcoe though. To be honest, it was more of an annoyance then a challange. It seemed every time I slept, I had to drink no matter what.

» Thu Jun 07, 2012 4:59 pm

You come across as highly ignorant of what a real "hardcoe mode" is with this post.

hardcoe modes exist to up the challenge in a realistic fashion so that the people who enjoy playing games really deeply can get immersed into the world that much more. New Vegas did a good job: primary needs, could not heal crippled limbs without special tools, no instant healing, weighted ammo... those kinds of things.

It is not about us wanting to clean up our homes for our mother-in-law's visit. That is not "hardcoe," that is stupid.

These are the people who are doing all the complaining that Skyrim's story arcs were terrible, you know.

I am glad someone here is saying something about the "core" hard players out there. Thumbs up!

» Thu Jun 07, 2012 3:38 pm

I think they could of improved the hardcoe though. To be honest, it was more of an annoyance then a challange. It seemed every time I slept, I had to drink no matter what.

True enough. But it was nice for them to extend an olive branch, all the same.

» Thu Jun 07, 2012 5:49 pm

I want to beat the hardcoe crowd to the punch, your exactly whats wrong with this community, and this is why Skyrim and the future TES games will be terrible :down:

This to the maximum

» Thu Jun 07, 2012 10:59 pm

Ok here goes...

I am a passionate gamer, especially when it comes to RPG games which I have played ever since the breakthrough of tabletop roleplaying games. I also work, and I have a family and other commitments, I don′t have endless of time to spend on making a game the ultimate experience of immersion.

In response to how a lot of people I read express themselves in regards to HOW the game should be played I would like to state the following:

-I FAST TRAVEL, all the time, everywhere...I don′t believe that my experience and enjoyment of the game is lost because I don′t spend 20 minutes hiking from Riften to Whiterun every time the thieves guild wants me to pickpocket someone. If I could fast travel in real life between my home and workplace I sure as hell would, so why would I not in a game? Maybe I will miss some fantastic conversation between a farmer and his wife by not taking the time to wander from place to place...I don′t care, I am having fun playing the game without discovering everything, and at the pace I progress I won′t be done with the game before something equally interesting and enjoying is released that I can enjoy. So it′s not like I am going to sit and have nothing to do when I am finished.

-No, I don′t read the books in Skyrim, neither did I read the books in Oblivion or Morrowind, because I am PLAYING a game. If I wanted to read I would pick up something by Stephanie Meyer and read it...

-I don′t look at the in-game time and think to myself "Oh, it′s almost 5 p.m. I must go and make myself a grilled leek sandwich now...". At the most I notice that the sky has shifted from bright to dark to bright again and figure it must have been night at some point.

-I am not bothered by the fact that most citizens repeat the same generic conversations over and over again, I appreciate that the developers put the time and effort to add some voiceacting in the background when I visit an inn and don′t worry much more about it.

-When I enter my home in Skyrim I go to the first container available and I dump EVERYTHING that I am not going to use right now or sell in the FIRST available container. It doesn′t bother me the least that my wardrobe is full of mushrooms, it makes it easier for me when I am looking for my mushrooms that I know that they are in the first container to the left when I come into my house.

-I don′t think that Morrowind is the greatest thing since sliced bread...in fact I didn′t enjoy it much at all. I don′t need to be told over and over again that EVERYTHING that is different than Morrowind makes the game worse...guess what, there is a game that is exactly like Morrowind, it′s called MORROWIND!

-If it′s in the game it′s a mechanic, NOT an exploit. Personally I don′t have the patience to stand at an Arcane Enchanter table and click and press R to get my enchanting skill to 100 so I can make nuclear bows, but if someone feels that′s what they want to do, then it′s a legitimate way to solve the game.

-I use the quest arrow, again in real life, if I was trying to find a location in town I would prefer to use a GPS than not using one. Though in Skyrim it′s not really needed most of the time since most dungeons only have one path anyway, what I wouldn′t have given for a quest arrow in Daggerfall though.

-I don′t eat, sleep, socialize, brush my teeth or get cleaned in game. If I wanted to play a game about everyday chores, I would play the Sims. If it has no effect in the game that I desire, I don′t do it. If brushing my teeth would give me a +15% frost resistance I would brush them all the time. It′s not like I am reading an adventure book or watching an actionmovie and think to myself, this would be so much more realistic and better if it portrayed Gandalf eating pancakes and trimming his toenails, why would I expect these things from a game in order for it to be entertaining?

We are the 99% of gamers...we like playing our games casually!
(Putting on my +75 Fire Resistance boots in preparation for the flames)

Fine, that is all well and good. There are other games that you can play like that. TES shouldn't be dumbed down just because you don't have time to immerse yourself in the game.

» Thu Jun 07, 2012 1:17 pm

well you need to start playing the game RIGHT, you are not enjoying the game correctly