But how do you expect Bethesda to outdo the customization of Saints Row 2 when it has layering options with clothing, along with some of the best face sliders in any game today? If there's a game that gives you more control over the looks of your characters, I haven't played it. And yes, the graphics are VERY dated, but that's what's crazy about it: The amount of customization in Saints Row 2 is so deep that its poor graphics don't inhibit it too much from making VERY realistic-looking people. If the customization was that deep in Saints Row: The Third, that would be [censored] nuts since the graphical difference between SR2 and SR3 is like night and day, and even that game looks cartoony.

And don't get me wrong, I'm not excusing Skyrim's lack of customization options. I'm always the one that says there should be several different-looking helms and chest pieces for each armor type, and I'm always pushing for spears, halberds, flails, and so on. I want the customization to be as deep as ever, but I don't think Bethesda, and perhaps any other developer out there, can possibly hope or even dream to match the customization of Saints Row 2. That game is on its own level.

Your "substance" was thus... TW2 is better than Skyrim because... opinion, opinion, opinion... No, sorry, no real substance there, just self-important editorial, really. I'm sorry, "your" thread? This is PD, kiddo, you own nothing. And as far as respect goes, IMO, you get what you give. Twenty, huh? Never would have guessed. I supppose you're 100% independent too, huh?

I actually don't remember buying very many games for 60 dollars. All my games have been bought when their prices dropped. Only a few games I've bought at the 50 dollar price, and that still not even the 60 dollar one.

Bioshock 2, which was absolutely hogwash and I was disappointed, but still enjoyed it.

It appears that I end up buying the sequels of games that end up being games I like.

Except Tw2. I just got it at 60 dollars and enjoyed it. I liked it. I think the game was good.

You're many months late. Deal with it.

It's not as if they lacked the resources and money to accomplish such a task.

"IT'S TOO HARD!".

its sad but not surprising that things that should be in vanilla or things that were once unlockable are now sold for a profit...these are the greedy times we live in

Wait just a sec... are you actually saying that being able to mix and match separates and accessorize is a laudable feature? Oh dear god, let's just all drop our swords and head off to Mandee's.

Yes actually.
In a series where the clothing options grow less and less customizable, to the point where you can only wear one ring at a time, it certainly is.

as i look at it no game will be perfect, there will always be people who like it, don't like it or somewhere in middle but for me personally elder scrolls games are worth 60 just on size alone and graphics alone. i bought that game in November and still playing it and still had not discovered all location, to me that's worth 60

-Todd Howard on creating realistic faces

Oh dear lord... hear that Bethesda? We don't have enough shades of lipstick to bring out the color in Altmer eyes. Oh boy.

I dont see how anyone can say skyrim is a terrible game, its a great game. Its just not a good TES game

inb4 quality>quantity.

What is the perception of film and television writers and directors? That they are rich, glamorous, and always get laid. The stereotype of video game company man? A poor, boring nerdy guy who gets none. So when it comes to associating actors to a media, who are the agents motioning to and the investors betting on? There's your answer.

I think that the point they're trying to make is that if gaming is supposed to move forward why are things decreasing in variety, options and customization?
It's really not that important to me if I can make a good looking character as I will be in first person the entire time, but it does make me scratch my head in confusion when Bethesda, being the size it is and given the time they've had, has so few options of customization.

I see it as a good move actually "shrug". It's kind funny though, after beating Dawnguard I was looking for a mod to give me a house secluded from the main cities and such because I was getting sick of the home I was currently using (Hjerim). I really couldn't find any decent mods that weren't completely overdone messes until I stumbled upon the "build your own house" mod. Funny enough a day later Hearthfire was announced! Go figure...

I disagree. I played Morrowind for the first time earlier this year and found it to be very similar to Skyrim almost immediately. I couldn't tell you which one I thought was better though.... Morrowind's graphics still shine even by today's standards I think! Just add some anti aliasing, anisotropic filtering and you've got yourself a beauty of a game! I wish I could say the same for Oblivion though.... I tried to get back into that game and it just wouldn't "click" with me. It hasn't aged very well at all. I'm sure I will get into the groove of Oblivion again someday though!

in what way was it similar? you think morrowind as aged better then oblivion mod free?

What leaves me scratching my head is how someone can say, with all of the races available to play as, all of the minute details of that individual that can be altered, all of the armor sets that can be used, all of the weapons that can be wielded, all of the amulets and rings, potions, enchantments, etc. that can be bought, found, or made, that Skyrim is "lacking in customization". Whoopie! Hair Dye! Awesome job Fable dudes. Seriously? You seriously believe that this is a "step backward", not having dye-able shirts? Well, yeah, I guess y'all are serious. My daughter had a game you'll love when she was five, something about Barbie or something like that.

What? Morrowind is my favorite TES game but really?

Dye?

Anyway, yes, I think it's a step back. But now I shall go to sleep so I can't explain why.... Bye!

No!
NO.

Have you not played Morrowind or Oblivion?
There are literally customizations options that have been TAKEN AWAY in Skyrim.
That's why it's a stepbackward.

I detected another opportunity to speak out against Oblivion. JUST IN THE NICK OF TIME.

Visually speaking, Oblivion has a sort of oddly out of place surrealistic, uncanny valley approach to everything. It looks GOOD, but in that strange sort of way where you're very much convinced everything down to the specks of dirt on the path you walk was recently pulled out of celophane. It's very "fake." Not to say that Morrowind, or even Skyrim, is the height of realistic quality, but seeing equipment on the glossy haired, oddly textured bodies just made it look like you sort of stuffed half a wad of play-dough beneath a period piece plate helmet and called it a guard.

Voice-acting-wise, Oblivion suffered greatly from being one of the first forays into full voice acting, with a very limited stable of voice actors. It was very hard to lose myself in the countryside when I could hear three people all with the exact same voices talking about one another. Had I not turned around to witness the conversation, I would have been very much convinced that I should be slowly walking away from an obvious sufferer of multiple-personality-disorder. Morrowind was not voiced outside of greeting text and the occasional quest snippet in the later expansion packs, so it's kind of an unfair comparison, but those greeting voices became somewhat endeared as "the standard sound of [Race]" and hearing the majority of them get shuffled around and re-arranged was a jarring transition.

Storywise, Oblivion tried too hard for the epic, obvious, save the world type motif. There was very little opportunity to logically step off the rails and get some side-questing done without feeling like you were carelessly endangering the known world, due to the fact a psychotic cult of mages and daedra worshippers was in fact trying to destroy said entire world. Taking missions to clear rats, bats, elephants, and go exploring for the city guard while being confronted with giant hellfire spewing, demon spawning stone monoliths is a little strange at the best of times. You are introduced to the most powerful man in all of civilized Tamriel within the first three minutes (after character generation), seen him cut down, given a carte blanche pardon and then told to go find the secret grandmaster of the secret organization, all within the first 30 minutes of the game.

Morrowind, by contrast, dumped you in an alien land, full of an alien people, with alien culture. You aren't even really aware of what the main storyline is until halfway through it, you aren't even ever formally confirmed to be The Hero, you just kind of clumsily stumble into a set of convenient parameters that make you sound kind of like The Hero, which I have never seen a game do again.

Even Skyrim doesn't grab you by the daddy-bags and throw you into the Save The World motif as fast as Oblivion did. I originally thought - incorrectly - that the Civil War was the main questline, as did several of my friends, and several people I had discussed it with, due to the fact none of us had treated ourselves to any pre-game spoilers. You're never really ordered to follow the main quest. You're given "false" information as to who would be the best authority to speak with concerning the dragons. You're only sent to Whiterun as a very polite request. Even after you're outed as the Dragonborn, no one tells you it's time for you to go end the Big Bad Dragon, they just say you're the best equipped to fight dragons in general. Even when you go speak to the Greybeards they don't rush you or reveal the Big Bad Plan, you're encouraged to find your own destiny, on your own time. The only way you get that "locked" sensation during the main quest is if you actively pursue it.

Meanwhile, Oblivion shoves the entire premise down your throat harder and faster than the original Mass Effect, with the same end result : How are you supposed to justify wandering off and exploring, or doing anything, while you're faced with the world destroying Oblivion Crisis.

Most people I see who applaud Oblivion as the sterling jewel in the belt of the series are either the type that really like the Point A to Point B with a little bit of wiggle room in between "traditional" RPGs that gave you clear, concise goals, or have them so heavily modded it may as well not be the original game anymore. Shivering Isles was, to me, intended as a massive apology, that they could still put out weird, enjoyable, unique experiences like they had in Morrowind and openly abandoned in order to recreate Medieval England show us Cyrodiil.

So you are complaining how Skyrim is low quality, but are praising Hearthfire. ... just


Oblivion svcked so bad, it scared me from trying Morrowind.