Practical use over stupid asociations. In my language, most words havea genre, but some don't, just because thats how It works, how the language has evolved over hundreds of years with Its everyday use. Now some people try to introduce variatios that sound stupid as [censored] and are really forced just so the language is "equal". It's not about how you say It, It's about what you say, period. People are leaning towards oversensibility, IMHO.

Dear god.

It isn't mankind because of men being 'superior' it's probably because according to the bible Adam was created first.
And do you really need to have all terms gender neutralised? Women have proven sixism is baseless with their actions.
Language isn't "Male dominated" and no-one uses mankind as a sixist term except for feminists.

Women have pretty much equal rights in general society, and many are in positions of power, but just because there has never been a female president doesn't make America sixist. The best man person for the job should get the job.

Well, for starters, you shouldn't be talking to anyone if you're surprised that he got annoyed.

What you're doing is asking someone else to change their masterpiece so that you feel gratified by it. You're basically saying that the creator of that song should change his vision because you don't agree with it. That's not how art is supposed to work. It's like me asking someone to change the Mona Lisa because one of the most famous paintings in the world is gender exclusive.

And if I may be blunt, the new lyrics kinda svck. It feels fake because you're warping the intended feel of the song into something meant to appease, not to please.
Look at the women in-game, and tell me with a straight face that they're not men's equals

I agree with Arctorius.

I love the use of the word probably. Obviously this is a subject you've spent a great deal of time with. But yeah, probably because of the bible, lol. Wouldn't have had anything to do with the world's longstanding issue of gender inequality. Nope. Not sure why I'm even bothering after seeing threads the other about their "hot" female characters who look like "real dolls".

I really think you are taking this a little too personal. It is his song, if you don't like it, you don't have to listen to it. If the guy is an _____ to you, don't visit any more of his stuff.

Far as Skyrim , men and women are equal except for a few pixles. There may actualy be more "warrior" women NPCs than men.

Who cares, its a game. If you want equal representation put in to a fantasy game then become a developer and make your own game, stop forcing crap on others.

I also imainge all you did is bump his views up, because a lot of people on this forum are going to look it up to see what the gripe is about.

Seeing as gender inequality is not an issue in society anymore it doesn't matter where words come from unless they are inherently sixist.
And I'm sorry for speculating LOLS LULZ, obviously if I don't have a degree in feminism I must be an idiot, can't just speculate on things unless I'm widely knowledgable on the subject.

And guess what, if there was a thread about hot mucly guys soiciety wouldn't have a problem with it, nevermind that men have self-esteem too, they were in charge for hundreds of years they can deal with it.

If you really get upset over people saying mankind or actor not actress maybe you should stop reading hidden meanings into everything.

42% of gamers are women. Keep that in mind guys. The OP has a point and Bioware is putting both the male and female Shepard on the collector's edition box.

And I'm sure there is a large percentage of men who also play as women in the game, so gender recognition is always good in a game, but I think what the OP is asking is a bit silly, most songs flow better if you pick a gender to sing about.

There is MAN and woMAN. Two kinds of Man, so Mankind. I fail to see the issue with it



As for women being represented equally. We have...
Female Jarls
Female Smiths
Female Guards
Female Soldiers
Female Merchants
Female Homeowners
Female Court-Wizards
Female Business Owners

There's women doing all the same jobs as men. Seems pretty equal to me. Hell, I've recieved orders from women in the game. So there's women in authority as well. As for the songs, it's poetry so there's always some freedom with language there. Hell, pretty sure I've heard Daughters of Skyrim in the game, as well as Sons and Daughters of Skyrim.

Well that's not true, either. Norse mythology contains a lot of female deity and there are female Norse heroes as well, just as there are in the game. The problem is that people of a certain mindset will seize on anything that justifies them playing the role of Brunhild the Perpetually Offended.

This is an argument you can't win, though. They'll just move the goalposts.

Both are represented equally which is fine.

I'm quite familiar with Norse mythology, I was referring more to Nordic songs and chants which usually take place from a male perspective.

unless you are commissioning the work. You can't tell the creator that they need to change their work because it doesn't agree with your views. The song is a tribute to the game but doesn't reflect what is happening in the game.

Skyrim has women in all level of society. from beggars to Business Owners/Faction leaders, to Jarls.

I see "sons" usually as gender neutral. While the image of a male nord or something may appear in your head, when someone talks about the "Sons of Skyrim" they don't mean all males. Maybe it's because I was taught to not take everything so literally, and after reading the Bible, you kind of get that. I'm glad I'm not one of those political correct people, hellbent on changing anthems, destroying institutional holidays and getting angry over words like "handicap".

That would be like me asking if Black people are equally represented in Skyrim. The answer is yes. And so are all of the Orcs, cats, and lizard people in the game. Silly.... This fem argument even makes its way into gaming...Not only is my character female, but guess what, black also. So I have satisfied political correctness...

Some people are always trying to ice skate uphill...There definitely is NOT a we hate women conspiracy at Bethesda, nor is there a "We Hate Blacks" conspiracy. Someone else wrote that you cannot expect all games, movies, songs, etc to meet your views. I don't see how women are under represented in this game. No need for this argument over a song made in tribute to the game.

No in fact in a society that seems to value battle prowess that comes from physical strength and most economy is based off of back-breaking labour they are overrepresented. Female smiths, female farm hands, female warriors, female Jarls. Heads of two (can be argued three) of the guilds (one of which doesn't even have a true leader). Female's own just as many if not more businesses. Of the few interesting characters it seems most are female. Imperial and a few other male armours show a lot of unnecessary skin too. Lucky it's just a game or all that would be silly.

They could have made 90% of the women look just like men, that would of been more "realistic" and they could of used the Arnold voice for all. I guarantee the first complaints about ugly would of been from women who wanted a pretty character.

For the box-art do you think gamers care? The game was hyped so much they could of wrapped the cover in craft paper and written Skyrim in crayon. Maybe they just went with a really generic "Viking" character, horns and all to project an image.

Are we gonna aim for equality until only females can hold power, your forced to play as a female hero and all armour is a giant sack? Be grateful Beth didn't just go with pure fan service for the majority of customers (male) *cough* Miranda *cough*.

Honest question is that 42% of actual "gamers" or just all people who play games, including the facebook/iphone casual players?

....



i think this sums up everything perfectly. i mean, im a man, i dont particularly care about women getting more equality (who doesnt enjoy being the dominate gender?), and i dont think skyrim is sixist. but this? this is just pure ignorance. this is an argument from a completely incorrect point of view. at first i didnt believe OP's story of people flaming him with insecure misogyny for making a minor suggestion, but now i can see it for myself.

you people need to stop crying "feminazi" and grow a pair. you dont need to reach for your manly flamethrowers everytime someone makes a perfectly valid point that happens to take the male-preference out of something. the song does not accurately match the tone of the game where even the backwards nord supremacist stormcloaks say "sons and daughters of skyrim". acknowledging that is not threatening your manhood.

There are lots of powerful women in skyrim, the only problem of concern I saw while watching my wife play a female character had to deal with a quest in markarth where without giving anything away the pc should have had lets say.. female roomates instead of male roomates, of course that would throw the whole quest out of whack. So yes there may be quest were it is assumed that the pc is male, but I think skyrim does a very good job of appealing to both male and female players, I want to believe that it might even be a 50/50 split with power players in the game (I am not going to count)

It feels as though your nitpicking at silly things like songs and dragon language to show an inequality in the game that simply does not exist.

I'm sorry, I didn't cry feminazi.

From my personal experience the majority of women in Australia, get equal oppurtunities and equal rights.

And saying sons and daughters of Skyrim would ruin the rhythm of the song.
Unless my sarcasm detector is faulty

Sorry just to clarify ... do you mean Bethesda games in general or games created by the Bethesda studio ....

I ask because Brink has the Bethesda logo all over it and doesnt have any female characters in it at all ... however it was created by ID .... i think

I am offended because i feel that Mer are under-represented in Skyrim. Elven Supremacy is the only truth!