That's as may be, but their bad experiences in the past don't excuse their present ideals and goals. It also doesn't make their manipulative attempts any more honorable or even nice. They don't try to kill Paarthurnax. They don't even volunteer to help you do it. No, it's "go do my bidding, svcker, and thanks for the new home, but you're not welcome back until you do just as we say". They don't by choice help you fight any dragon at all. That's very different from their "OMG, u r teh dragonborn we has waited so long, we luvs u" crap they had been telling you previously. Serve and protect the dragonborn my butt-tocks. Serve themselves, more like it

?? You already have the option to not kill him

It's a damn shame the option wasn't available to make her a follower, because I would have led her up to the Sacellum of Boethiah's alter of sacrifice without a moments hesitation. God I hate that insufferable, indestructable woman.

yes, the same woman that can whisk away the horn of Jurgen Windcaller can't find a rock in Bleak Falls Barrow

I was thinking that maybe she underestimated herself, and heard one too many stories from Ralof and Hadvar about scary draugrs.. and then.. when she heard you got the dragonstone, she gave it a shot to go into one of these crypts. Considering the Blades penchant for spying and stealth, I imagine she's kind of got the same type of skills as Karliah and Mercer, and managed well.

This is exactly what he does when you finish the main quest with him alive, though Odahviing doubts that many dragons will follow Paarthurnax. The quest to slay Paarthurnax also will be closed then, if you care about such things.

Paarthurnax is guilty of enslaving humans, this was the way of his people in ancient times. But he gave man the means to fight for their freedom, and tried to further atone for his deeds by living in seclusion for over 5000 years, waiting for the day when Alduin returns to construct his final demise. It may be that Paarthurnax ulterior motive is to replace Alduin, but there is no reason to slay him for future deeds, the people he wronged obviously deemed it right to let him live, so there is no reason now to slay him for some obscure rumors about past atrocities.

The Blades are bitter old xenophobes, their spy network was shattered by the Thalmor, and the emperor abandoned them, and now they chose to follow in the tradition of their precursors, Tsaesci who genocided men and dragons in Akavir and pursued the few surviving dragons all the way to Tamriel. Story-wise, the blades were dispensable the moment we learned about Dragonrend, they had less business to show up at the armistice talks than the Thalmor ambassador.

If anyone has read mysterious akavir, i think there's a slight chance of an invasion by the tiger dragon king there. In which case, Blades or Paarth might be allies.

At least I can hope.

Exacly.. The Blades should focuse on the Thalmor now.

In a way, I pity Esbern and Delphine. Assumng Delphine's in her 50s and the two of them were on the run for 30 years since the Great War, she spent the most of her prime of life fleeing from a group very determined to see every last Blade fall. Every second, every minute, every hour of every day, she had to keep a wary eye on any and all Thalmor sympathizers or (worse) Thalmors themselves. Any Altmer that entered that inn, I'm sure she took a deep breath and silently prayed to the Divines that this Altmer wasn't a Thalmor looking for her.

30 years of this. She knows that she and Esbern are the last of the Blades. She likely saw her comrades get horribly butchered. No wonder she and Esbern lost it and adopted the veiw on life as they have.

So, while I don't agree with thier 'with us or against us' attitude, I can sympathize with them and not wish them death.

I refuse to kill Paarthurnax. I won't. I wouldn't. I didn't.

And.

Actually Nietzsche said traditional morality was the way to go for the vast majority of people and was very good for them. He just thought truly exceptional individuals didn't need to follow it.


Yeah, it is pretty weird how they have the Blades act after you talk to Paarthurnax. They seem to do a near 180 from doing what they can to help you to demanding things from you or they won't do anything for you...despite the fact the world is on the line.

I can't decide whether the Devs just rushed it, or whether the two remaining Blades are really supposed to come across as two people who claim to serve the Dragonborn like the ancient blades but are really just self-serving liars. It does seem strange that both remaining Blades would be the same way, Esbern especially. I mean, it isn't like the old Blades wouldn't serve the Emperor unless he killed Paarthurnax, so I don't see why these two are so high and mighty about it.

eh i won't kill Big P, he's the Man Dragon.

And i thought only the dragonguard were dragonslayers, not the dragonborn? i thought the dragonborn was part Dova making him part dragon? ( fill me on please im lost on this lol )

But even so, I slay many dragons except Big P. Theres plenty of dragon's around anyway lol

I don't see it as a 180. I think the Blades have acted in that demanding, rude, and insolent manner since the first time you meet them.

I hope they come. Ka Po Tun and Their Khajiit Bretheren Unite!

Eh that's true, but I don't demand subservience from allies, just help towards a common goal. Once they aren't even willing to do that, I have no more use for them, either.

On my new game I'm going to at least give them Lydia, as an alternative to pushing her off a cliff. Three's a crowd at Breezehome.

Actually, that's about the best reason I've heard for going there in future - to dump all the idiot wannabe followers on Delphine and Esbern.

Thats not the argument guy. Delphine and Esbern state the Blades are to serve the dragonborn.

I doubt that we're all stupid.

It's actually a pretty normal expectation to have NPC's reacting to heroic efforts of the main (heroic) character. In Skyrim it never happens, no one gives a crap about the Dragonborn, or what he's done for everyone around him. So most of the time the average player is starved for a cookie from someone, anyone... and certainly didn't expect to have a pathetic two-member faction consisting of a crazy, paranoid tavern lady and an old man from the filthy bowels of the Ratway giving orders and practically demanding that you slay this wise dragon, who happens to be a trusted friend.

When I apply logic I see some major credibility issues with the so-called Blades. Slay your friend because some day he might turn evil. Oh, ok. It's just in case! Wow, what a great plan!
How about we wipe out the Blades instead? You know, just in case they all get dead-thralled by evil necromancers and help them destroy some village.

Besides, if Paarthunax did in fact turn on everyone and become the bad guy... can't they just hope fate will deliver another Dragonborn? Or some other hero-equivalent?

It just makes more sense to rationalize murder and genocide. Kill them just in case.
Oh, ok! Yeah, lemme get right on that one.

Please keep in mind, discussion of real world religions is not permitted.

If traveling to sovenguard and killing the dragon that will bring about the end of the world isnt considerd hard enough work for them to listin to my reasoning about parthunax, then I dont think anything will be.

I mean, with out him, I couldnt have saved the world, and they would be dead. After every thing you and him have done, they should be smart enough to listin to you. Sadly, these arent the wise and heroic blades of martin septems time, this is an old delusional man, and some mean old [censored]. They are hardly worth helping any way, and can sit and rot in thier temple for all I care.

Do what I did and shout these two asses off the mountain like I did.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKonJm34bsg <~~~~ a nice tip.

There's a little more to it. If you've played any of the previous games, you WERE a Blade. You have every reason to believe you know something about them, their attitude, their service to the Emperor, and how they should act. People who have followed the series for five games or so have expectations about the Blades.

By every reasonable argument, the Blades should be working to put the Dragonborn on the throne of Tamriel. That's the way it works. That's the way it always has worked. They should be taking orders, not giving them. It's not like the Empire has such a competent Emperor that it makes sense to leave him in charge until the Thalmor succeed in destroying mankind for good. It's not like the Empire couldn't use a savior. The Empire is is desperate straits and BEGGING for a savior. And here you are. And the barmaid who claims to be the head of the Blades rises to the situation by... behaving just like a barmaid. Delphine is apparently too limited to see what's dropped in her lap, even after you save the world. After you finish the main quest she says, basically, "Huh, I never would have guessed a loser like you could pull it off."

Thanks!

The Blades are kind of the poop icing on the top of the poop cake, though, since everyone from small children on up treats you like a worm. My husband isn't playing but sits in the same room with me while I play, and he's said that I need to start making notes of every time someone insults me. It becomes hilarious after you start paying attention to it. Storekeeper: "Well, I guess you can't be as stupid as you look." Child: "I'm not afraid of you!" Man on street: "Do you get to the ritzy part of town? Of course not, loser." Servant: "Oh sure, I have nothing better to do than carry your stuff." Guard: "Don't make trouble in my town!" Blacksmith, when asked about his past: "Are you stupid? I'm a blacksmith, are you blind?" There's even a particular quest which is ABOUT how your momma dresses you funny, loser.

Really, did all the writers have moms who beat them as children? I was a geek in school, and I get insulted more in one day of Skyrim than I did in four years of high school.

Good post.... the only part I don't have much agreement with is about being a Blade in the previous games.... I really wasn't. I ran one toon through the MQs of the previous 4 games. Usually early. Then I spent the next decade or so playing the games my way.... with no references to the MQ. I've actually never had any use for the Blades from day 1....

It could be argued that you just weren't a very GOOD Blade...

My husband does the same with his characters. Usually I've already played through the MQ and spoilered it for him, so he's not interested. He jokes about the Blades back in their headquarters saying, "What did you expect when you gave an important message to a Wood Elf vagrant?"

ROFL!!!