You are right, that is my fault I was not clear.

Passive Dodging - Player has no control over if they successfully dodge an attack. This is a hit-check system which "rolls" against player evasion rating versus enemy attack.
Active Dodging - Player has control over if they successfully dodge an attack. This is not a hit-check system.

The way I envision the Active Dodging to work is much like Silent Roll. Depending on the direction you are moving hitting Sprint + Crouch for example may perform a quick roll or jump which will place you out of Melee range and give you the advantage of attacking your target from the side.

The way I envision the Parry/Counterattack system to work is timed. Pressing "Block + Attack" or whatever you want to assign the function to, at the appropriate time (enemy is in mid swing or starting a swing) the player will be able to Parry the attack and strike the enemy or disarm them.

Also, 1st or 3rd person this does not change how these work.

No it's not.

You say it sarcastically, yet that's what you keep attempting to do every time you reply without providing any substance.


The reason you keep waiting to repeat this is because you have no actual defense for the combat system itself; the only "argument" youv'e got to rely on is to claim that the other person is abusing the game somehow. The problem with this is that I've already explained and pointed out how that's not the case.


Then stay out of the thread if you've got nothing ot contribute. Like I said in my first reply to you; it's hillarious when people like you call others trolls then you make posts like this.


Wow, you really can't make any argument that hasn't been refuted before, can you? I already went over how, sure, I could run in circles every now and then to pretend I'm "dodging" attacks, but there's no tactical reason to when you can just drink 3 potions instantly and be back at full health. Heck, the fact that just walking backwards and channeling a healing spell makes it near impossible for any melee character to kill you shows how terrible the combat system is (that's how I killed the frost troll heading towards Hrothgar).


"Hit enemies to stagger them." Wow that's awesome advice. Or I could just click spam which keeps them perma staggered anyway.


There's no such thing as a favorable attacking position! You can't roll around behind an enemy to get around their defenses, the AI just sticks to you and follows you wherever you go. There's no reason to even attempt to get behind someone unless you're a stealth character, which I've already explained is one of the only situations where the gameplay is mildly interesting.

You never NEED to "spring to get out of trouble" because potions are instant and going into your inventory to use them pauses time.


So many terrible arguments, it's amazing. No they're not falling on death ears, it's just that your arguments consist of intentionally handicaping yourself and passing it off as "depth." How about I randomly un equip my items to pretend they've been disarmed, or stop using certain buttons to pretend that different parts of my character's body were damaged. Oh maybe I should also walk around dungeons backwards to pretend that enemies can actually sneak up to me and use any semblence of tactics.

Or maybe these sort of things could be actually built into the game so the combat actually had some depth instead of relying on players to create their own articifial depth.

Weapon repair is a mundane task which doesn't has no say on whether or not a combat system is solid or not. You could add weapon repairing to Skyrim and it wouldn't change the core combat system.

The game doesn't have poor hit registration, it has just weapon ranges which are bigger than what is displayed visually. And I disagree. Poorly implemented mechanics are just gimmicky and have no place in a solid combat system. Furthermore, your footwork must be off if you're having trouble dodging attacks without a poorly implemented and gimmicky "active dodge".

Honestly, active dodging is almost as gimmicky as Age of Conan's "active blocking".

It's no more important than in oblivion, you're making this up as you go along.

But it is'nt as intrinsic as exploration, at all. Exploration comes first, and combat second. That's how it is. It's obviously neccesary to some degree, but it is'nt as important as other elements. And yes, there is'nt much more you can do with it, without completely scrapping and re-inventing it, which is why i've been saying that it won't change, because if combat were made more of a focal aspect, it would draw away from some of the other more important aspects that TES is known for.

Of course it would, having the opportunity to break the enemy's shield in combat would change the combat massively.

And how is that not poor hit registration? If the game counts a hit when no hit should be counted, then the hit registration is not functioning as it should.

The mechanic worked fine, the only thing particularly poor about it was the fact you could leap in a circle and had to have high acrobatics skill to pull it off. Footwork won't get you anything in this game against an armed humanoid opponent other than perhaps one free hit unless you're using the quick reflexes perk. You can assert otherwise all you want but you're talking out your ass unless you upload a video proving your point. Footwork is not as effective as an active dodge mechanic.

No you're missing the point. You can't have one without the other, they are staple necessities of gameplay in TES games; especially for the majority of people who don't walk everywhere just to see how pretty things are (protip: Skyrim isn't even that pretty)

You can say what you want about exploration first, combat second, but it doesn't change the fact that the game could not exist without both. The formula of TES games is go somewhere --> kill something --> Profit. Plus, making combat better =/= making combat a focus at the expense of exploration. Personally I'd rather have less exploration and more meaningful dungeons anyway.

I don't understand why we have to deal with sub-par combat mechanics becaue it isn't a multi-player game. I also do not understand why you seem to be arguing against possible improvements to the combat system. I don't think (at least myself) we are placing a whole lot of scrutiny on the combat system. These are glaring issues and a 100 ft. overview. Blocking, is the only Active defense mechanic. Backpedaling and Sprinting are not Active defense mechanics, they are just mechanics people are using as a defensive means. There are almost no active offensive combat skills. Magicka is entirely active (besides the obvious passive buffs).

Do you see what I mean?

Eye of the beholder I say. You see what you want to see.


The reason I say this is because of the countless Youtube videos I've seen of mindless stand still slashing that is only occurring because the numbers for those particular instances are heavily in favor of the player and what you've stated thus far has shown no different.


I'm contributing. It may have not been to your liking, but contributions no less.


So essentially you're saying that the combat system is bad on the basis of numbers being skewed in your favor? This here shows me that you can't really thoroughly evaluate a combat system. What you're saying is essentially irrelevant to what you're responding to. It's akin to stating that the combat system svcks when you do player.tgm and player.forceav meleedamage 9001.


Not sure why you're using quotation marks when that's not something I stated. If you choose to ignore options that are in front of you that's on you, it really is.


Actually, you can, but I won't elaborate on how because to be quite honest, you don't deserve my guidance.


I was speaking more of using sprint to maneuver out of unfavorable environment positions and avoid getting hit in the process, like you most likely would were you to try at normal speed.


That's not an argument for why a combat system is flawed. It's like saying that toggle god mode trivializes combat. Herp derp.


No, it's definitely falling on deaf ears, especially when you keep using the word "potions".


Combat has depth that is proper to the game and the genre, however, it's not the game's fault if you blind yourself to it. I'm not arguing that you can't do mindless slashing, because you can, but that's not all there is to it. You're the equivalent of a new player chugging down potions left and right, essentially giving yourself God Mode, svcking at combat, and then complaining that combat svcks. It's on you buddy.

I disagree. Although I wouldn't expect someone praising Oblivion's combat and active dodging to understand.

Hits need to register at a weird time otherwise those "cool animations" they want to display will hamper the game. The use of "Block" or an Active Dodge (if there was one) however, would be the exception to this rule. It would override a registered hit and not require you to Block or Dodge at a weird time. As long as visually, it is performed before the attack lands, it would be successful. It makes sense however that Backpedaling for example, may register a hit even if you move out of range during it.

Ad Hominems do not make you right. Prove your point or Please continue, my good sir..

It's ok, I also wouldn't expect someone who thinks that spamming the left mouse button and arbitrarily running in circles to understand what a deep combat system is like.


Pretty clear you've got no idea what you're talking about at this point. Have fun digging your hole deeper.

You seem to be confusing my arguments. If anything, I'm arguing that it's not a mindless slashfest, because it isn't. If anything, I understand that it can have as much detail as other combat systems which are present in multiplayer games. I'm not against improvement, but I'm a realist when it comes down to it. Besides, no one is talking about Backpedaling, I'm talking about footwork. You can't disregard footwork and claim they're just mechanics people are using as a defensive means.

The combat is good enough for a game of this genre and this style of play. Can it be better? Sure. Lets try and be realistic about things though. O.o ...

My statement was just as empty as your statement regardless of what fallacies you can name.

Pretty clear you don't have much to say so you're trying to save face with this irrelevant comment. I replied to your "big" post, quote for quote, but go on, dig your hole deeper.

No, no it won't. Skyrim isn't an MMO that tries to simulate real time combat. If you're getting hit while "backpedaling" as you state, it's because weapon ranges are larger than they appear and backpedaling is slower than other forms of movement.

90% of wat u do in skyrim involves combat

go on a quest > attack enemies> find loot >return loot

exploring > attack enemies find loot and sell loot

yes a simplistic version of it but all i seem to do in skyrim kill people or animals, talk to sum1 npc which tell me to go and kill something or get something.

unless u either run from every1 or hide from every1 all u do in skyrim is hack and slash

so to me a better combat system would improve the gameplay considerably.

i think the lock on system is astupid idea personally i use keyboard and mouse and i never have trouble facing my target

but have options on how to attack other than spam my mouse buttons would add some skill to combat

games these days get rid of learning curves coz new generation gamers dont like to learn

i would have liked u to actually have to train and increase your actual skills and not the numbers in the game to be a good combat character

Nope. You made the assertion that movement in Skyrim is more important than it has ever been in the TES series. Either prove that it is more important or stop posting.. It's as simple as that.

Well, you've made the assertion that active dodging in Oblivion was useful. Either prove that it is useful or stop posting.

Sorry, I was too busy letting my character contract every ingame disease to further handicap my character in an effort to pretend the combat has "depth."

I thought you were too busy making irrelevant posts and ignoring responses to your posts.

*sigh* 'Exploration first, combat second' doesn't mean 'all exploration, no combat'. It means the exploration is the more important mechanic, not that it is the only mechanic. I am fully aware that combat is an important part of TES, but the point I am trying to make is that it is not -the most important- so investment of resources to improve it is not neccesary. It simply is as good as it's going to get.

I miss the days of tactical combat now we have these devices of first person shooters and good graphics.. edit- and dont forget the voice acting apparatus..