I fought for the Stormcloaks in the Civil war. I had two reasons for this, one was just roleplaying a simple-minded, thuggish Nord who was frightened of magic. The other was that I despise imperialism, and I agree with the Stormcloaks that peoples should be able to govorn themselves, wether they be Breton, Nordic, or otherwise. I'm very much pro-localisation.

This was awkward for me as a player, as I sympathise greatly with the Forsworn of the Reach, evicted from their land by none other that Stormcloak himself.

The more I saw of Ulfric, the more and more I hated the man. He dripped arrogance and falseness, every speech I could just tell was a lie. He was a power-hungry dog. But I didn't mind because I agreed with his cause...until I found out more about him. He's racist, or at least racism enabling. He's short-sighted. He was responsible for massacres of men, women and children (read The Bear of Makarth) in the Reach, who turned out to be a peaceful kingdom after ousting the Empire and the Nords.

He just seems so irredeemable, I may agree with his cause (to an extent at least) but I despise the man, and I totally see why Empire players what to chop his head off.

Is there anybody out there who likes Stormcloak? Try and justify him to me.

As one of the Gray-Manes says, he's the devil you know. That's better than an Empire controlled by the Thalmor who are dragging away people because of their beliefs. The Empire has no more legitimacy anymore because the fake Emperor sold his throne to them.

No, he's a racist cretin and needs to be killed off.

He's a monster. You don't have to murder and massacre to lead a revolution. Your cause should be just enough that the popular movement falls in behind you without the need for atrocities against civilians. To me, any "revolutionary" that has to kill masses of his own people is just a tyrant in potentia.

He's pretty difficult to like. If you want to go with the Stormcloaks it should really be more because you believe in their ideals and not because you like Ulfric.

Personally I'm not generally a fan of devolution, but Skyrim's cause seemed genuine in my stormcloak playthrough. I wanted them to be free, because ultimately the Thalmor do have too much influence over the empire currently. However, I'm now playing an empire playthrough and it's a great thing to look forward to out-shouting and decapitating Ulfric.

I agree with you in principle. The only legitimate response to this is the comparative one. The empire may have banned Talos worship, but they aren't cracking down on the enforcement of it. Lastly, have they done anything heinous like Stormcloak has? Massacres? Murder? I don't see it. I think that, even with the empire as weak as it is, it is the lesser of evils.

you hav it all rong my good sir!

You see my good sir, he is a true hero of skyrim!
hell, ulferic should have been the draginborn!!

But one could also argue that allowing the empire dominion when it has the power neither to control or protect you is an evil in itself. By accepting the dominion of a weakened empire you could be doing your people a disservice, and ultimately end up owing resources to the empire to fund their recovery.

Can't argue with the word of Talos himself! hahahha

They probably made Ulfric that way to give the choice more weight. Seen this sort of scenario a lot. X is fighting for a good cause but X turns out to be a person with questionable morals.

Never trust a man who can't spell his heroes name.

...or wrong. Or Dragonborn.

Sometimes, you have to be cruel to be kind. Tiber Septim was not the saint he's made out to be, either. Is he a monster? Sure. That doesn't mean he can't or shouldn't be the High King of Skyrim. He cares about the Nords and their culture.

I don't know how butchering women and children is 'being cruel to be kind' I see it as vindictive slaughter

Ulfric is actually a Thalmor agent. If you read the dossiers from the embassy, he is an inactive Thalmor agent. In other words, helping Ulfric is furthering the Thalmor aims. I'd kill him on those reasons alone.

Tell me you're not serious?

I really do like and admire Ulfric, because of his voice.
Not really his dragon-voice, just the actor-voice in English.

Shame he's not marriage-able

I'm sort of a fan. I imagine spending Christmas with him would be pretty horrible and I don't see him as a good kindergarten teacher, but he is wonderfully Machiavellian. He has a layman as an adviser so that he can always get a second opinion from someone who isn't too involved - that is a lot better than only listening to his generals. Everything is PR with this guy. He killed the king "to send a message to the jarls". He wanted the jarl of Whiterun to leave his own city in disgrace in order to show other jarls what would happen if they oppose him (no martyrdom and a one-way ticket to Sovngarde - just humiliation and disgrace). I would say that he deals too much in absolutes, but I guess the same could be said for any faction in Skyrim.
I respect Ulfric Stormcloak the war-leader, but as a person he is too broken. Galmar says "his anger floats on a sea of tears". Also, I imagine that he is an angry drunk .

disagree

Thats not completly true. He is not a willing agent, he is a person the thalmor believe they can manipulate but only very carefully. The very same dossier says that he gets hostile if approached and should not be handled in a direct manner. He is in no way a willing thalmor agent.

For those who complain about him being racist, well the thalmor did take him hostage and interrogate him(torture) so big surprise if he no longer trusts any other races. Personally, i liked him and supported a Nord ruled skyrim, That doesn't mean that the nords would never assist the empire in a war against the thalmor, just that the nords will no longer be ruled by a subverted empire and told what to think and who they can worship.

I don't see how butchering women is any worse than butchering men, especially in Skyrim or Tamriel in general, though I obviously understand the point with children. That said, there isn't going to be any major leader or conqueror in the world that doesn't commit heinous crimes against humanity in some way. Take Vivec, for example. He, along with the other Tribunal, murdered Nerevar and broke an oath to Azura. They later went on to make life wonderful for their people. If you can't accept things like that, then you'll be stuck with leaders who are going to be killed and overrun by those who can. I'm not saying I approve of Ulfric and everything he does. I'm not even saying that Ulfric approves of everything he's done. But I am saying that I sided with the Stormcloaks and helped Ulfric rise to power.

*nods*

This elf approves...

Just like politics: "Take the lesser of two evils......







or assassinate them all :3"

lolz

I will gladly side with whoever kills those annoying [censored] of kids.

*shakes head*

This Nord disapproves. Skyrim for Nords!!!!

If only the game would let me make a necklace out of elf ears. lol

Agreed. The Empire is crumbling under the very poor leadership of the current Emperor. Sumerset Isle dictates Imperial policy. Hammerfell has seceded, and the Redguards fought the Altmer/Thalmor to a standstill. Would like to see the Nords do the same, or better.

As far as Aldmer colonial tendencies, I have to wonder if the Sload are not somehow involved...

I went with him because

A ) he was brave in the face of his execution
and
B ) the Empire was willing to execute me because their paperwork wasn't done properly.

From there, he did things I didn't like, but by that point, I was clearly on his side.