[Neko Jenny]

Original sounds.

Yeah, that's right. Bring back the original sounds from DOOM 1 & 2.

I still don't understand why people want them to move backward rather than forward with the next game in the series.

The sounds from the original Doom 1&2 may have been good at the time, but I'd rather not be stuck with something that became obsolete when the Nintendo 64 was invented.

[Lillian Cawfield]

The sounds from the original Doom 1&2 may have been good at the time, but I'd rather not be stuck with something that became obsolete when the Nintendo 64 was invented.

You're confusing the sounds from DOOM with the sounds of the Super Mario Bros. They could literally use the same old sounds as before but add more clarity as modern technology can afford, and literally nobody would complain.

Back when DOOM came out, they were top-notch, gathered from sound databases used by Hollywood (especially noticeable with the door sounds) or created by very, very talented sound artists.

And that's not even getting into the music. The music... it's epic. And people... well, they're constantly keeping it modern. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-8wo0KBQ3oI&feature=related.

Adding the classic sounds wouldn't be a step back, not at all.

[Cesar Gomez]

You're confusing the sounds from DOOM with the sounds of the Super Mario Bros. They could literally use the same old sounds as before but add more clarity as modern technology can afford, and literally nobody would complain.

Back when DOOM came out, they were top-notch, gathered from sound databases used by Hollywood (especially noticeable with the door sounds) or created by very, very talented sound artists.

And that's not even getting into the music. The music... it's epic. And people... well, they're constantly keeping it modern. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-8wo0KBQ3oI&feature=related.

Adding the classic sounds wouldn't be a step back, not at all.

...OR, they could make a new game instead of jerking off their old ones from 90's.

But I guess "New = BAD!" is still the ruling notion in the world, as always.

[Cathrin Hummel]

...OR, they could make a new game instead of jerking off their old ones from 90's.

But I guess "New = BAD!" is still the ruling notion in the world, as always.

Wow, guys, I didn't know this. Apparently, a sound is a video game.

Holy crap, those Pong guys really lied to us. First video game came out in Africa and it was called "Banging Rocks Together Hero."

Dude, seriously. What the hell do the noises even matter? The noises were good, and I personally thought they gave the game some personality. You really think that just 'cause I like the old I hate the new. Untrue. I don't think that some of the new weapons or enemies in DOOM 3 were bad. And I enjoy playing DOOM on the Skulltag port just so I can put in "idkfa" and blow demons away with a minigun and a grenade launcher. The thing is, a lot of the "new" stuff in DOOM 3 was really just repackaging the old. It's an FPS, no, THE FPS, there really isn't that much room for innovation. Instead, what people demand is that they be honest with the fact that they can't change things. Making the Cacodemon brown and full of pipes on the bottom didn't make it different from the original. It only made me think that id was insecure about the fact that they basically had the same game with a few different aspects (a lot of people will tell me that's not true, especially because of innovations in lighting. I remind people that DOOM also had technological innovations that made it stand out from it's predecessor, Wolf3D.

Look, I'm not sure where you get the idea that somehow, the original DOOM's gameplay svcks by modern standards. There are still thousands of fans of original DOOM who continue to churn out new levels and ports to evolve that same, basic play style from 16 years ago. They don't change it, they just make it better. I never said new was bad, but if you try to make a DOOM game where 'we need to make something new' is on your mind, it won't be DOOM anymore. Look, I enjoy modern games. But DOOM isn't the same breed. Even DOOM 3 isn't the same breed. You can carry more weapons than is realistically possible, you can move faster than normal people have any right to move (not quite as fast as in the original, but it's still there) and you have a decidedly non realistic and non-tactical approach to combat. Sure, you've got different strategies for each enemies, but at the end of the day all you have to keep straight is what bad guy does what and how many bullets it takes to make them stop shooting. Bad guys are as numerous as they are powerful, and the challenge doesn't come from enemy intelligence. They're still pretty much the same old monsters from DOOM with a fresh new coat of paint and the same functional brain-death as before.

All the innovation DOOM really needs is semi-intelligent enemies. I mean, that would blow the mind of any one who's ever played one of the other three.

[Jade]

...OR, they could make a new game instead of jerking off their old ones from 90's.

But I guess "New = BAD!" is still the ruling notion in the world, as always.

You are misunderstanding the point. As defaulted explains below, it isn't about using the sounds as they were in 1993, it's about making those sounds better but still recognizable. Case in point: Mario. Mario has used the same sounds for 20 years.

Wow, guys, I didn't know this. Apparently, a sound is a video game.

Holy crap, those Pong guys really lied to us. First video game came out in Africa and it was called "Banging Rocks Together Hero."

Dude, seriously. What the hell do the noises even matter? The noises were good, and I personally thought they gave the game some personality. You really think that just 'cause I like the old I hate the new. Untrue. I don't think that some of the new weapons or enemies in DOOM 3 were bad. And I enjoy playing DOOM on the Skulltag port just so I can put in "idkfa" and blow demons away with a minigun and a grenade launcher. The thing is, a lot of the "new" stuff in DOOM 3 was really just repackaging the old. It's an FPS, no, THE FPS, there really isn't that much room for innovation. Instead, what people demand is that they be honest with the fact that they can't change things. Making the Cacodemon brown and full of pipes on the bottom didn't make it different from the original. It only made me think that id was insecure about the fact that they basically had the same game with a few different aspects (a lot of people will tell me that's not true, especially because of innovations in lighting. I remind people that DOOM also had technological innovations that made it stand out from it's predecessor, Wolf3D.

Look, I'm not sure where you get the idea that somehow, the original DOOM's gameplay svcks by modern standards. There are still thousands of fans of original DOOM who continue to churn out new levels and ports to evolve that same, basic play style from 16 years ago. They don't change it, they just make it better. I never said new was bad, but if you try to make a DOOM game where 'we need to make something new' is on your mind, it won't be DOOM anymore. Look, I enjoy modern games. But DOOM isn't the same breed. Even DOOM 3 isn't the same breed. You can carry more weapons than is realistically possible, you can move faster than normal people have any right to move (not quite as fast as in the original, but it's still there) and you have a decidedly non realistic and non-tactical approach to combat. Sure, you've got different strategies for each enemies, but at the end of the day all you have to keep straight is what bad guy does what and how many bullets it takes to make them stop shooting. Bad guys are as numerous as they are powerful, and the challenge doesn't come from enemy intelligence. They're still pretty much the same old monsters from DOOM with a fresh new coat of paint and the same functional brain-death as before.

All the innovation DOOM really needs is semi-intelligent enemies. I mean, that would blow the mind of any one who's ever played one of the other three.

:thumbsup:

Well said.

[JERMAINE VIDAURRI]

If there's a list of things I'd love to see from this game, it'd be the following:

-More varied movement and tactics to the various hellspawn (for example remember how awesome it was during those scripted bits of Imps crawling on the ceiling and whatnot? Imagine them being able to scale walls and ceilings at any moment, throw fireballs from them, and even pounce from those positions).
-If it's being reborn in a horror type fashion ala Doom 3, maybe an ammo scarcity/weapon reduction but thrown in with a more personal melee system. Though really, I'd still be fine with a ten weapon carrying badass.
-Throw a bit more units at us at a time. Doom 3 didn't really incorporate multiple unit engagements until way later, at which point they were only imps anyways and could simply be circle-strafed and shotgunned down.
-Make those big badasses even harder to kill. With how much ammo, armor, and HP you find laying around they still seemingly drop in too few of hits. They're fictional demons, it's perfectly acceptable of them to take a few more rockets to the face.

[Nicola]

One thing that Doom 3 got right was hell. The hell maps were damned cool and I would love to see more of hell. Doom 3 also had some cool tech levels and I hope Doom 4 expands on that and has more variety as D3 seemed a bit repetitious at times with all the similar looking places. We don't have to return to hell but I certainly would like to at least see some tech base maps with the whole corrupted by hell theme going on...

Some of the things that bugged me about Doom 3 included the lack of windows and the silly air-tanks. You have one of the coolest looking settings in the entire solar system with a high tech base sitting on the surface and lets leave out 99% of the windows, except for a couple and a skylight or two. Hmmm ok... I guess I was the only one who wanted to see more of the surface and to pass by more windows and get more of that atmospheric feeling of being on Mars. Then to make it even more weird, lets go outside BUT you only have 20 secs of air in an air tank so... when you do get outside RUN to get back inside again. No... please I don't leik this idea at all. I wanted to explore more of the surface. So you know, if they have part of Doom 4 on another planet, they should you know... have the UAC architects realize that glass isn't really all that rare. heh. I suppose they left the windows out in Doom 3 because they wanted the place all dark and dreary. Maybe my brain is broken and D3 actually had more windows than I recall.

I liked the new enemies in Doom 3. I like that they expanded on the zombies and also liked the maggot, wraith, trite and vagary.

Bring back the spider mastermind and NOT as an end boss. Do something different for the end.

I would like to see an archvile that resurrects enemies like in the original series. It may mean letting the dead bodies lay around instead of dissolving and thus destroy some peoples framerate... haha.

One thing is for sure. We all played D3 and didn't see a cyberdemon until... and then had to kill it... well you know if ye played it and personally I just didn't like that at all. I hope to hell that Doom 4 has more cyberdemons in various places and you can use whatever weapon you want.. if you have the ammo you have the means. I mean come on, I want to be walking along and hear that waking up noise and the evil stomping about or get a rocket or two suddenly blow me up.

Secret areas. Games today svck with the complete lack of or have what I call lazy secrets. I mean really, some ammo under an open set of stairs that you can find while dozing off is not much of a secret. The earlier Doom games and games like Quake and Quake II had cool areas to find which took some exploring and looking around the map. Please for the love of infighting demons, bring back the old school type of secret areas. I want to shoot a damned switch in the ceiling and have a panel drop to some fancy looking room with gear or some weapon I never found on my first play through. Hell you could step it up a notch and do stuff like have to find 3 secrets in various levels to assemble a weapon or somefin. Speaking of secrets, I did like Doom 3's lockers and having to find codes on PDA's to open them and stuff... that was all good but no locker should ever replace a real secret area. They could do stuff like have a PDA rumor about some dudes hiding a stash of gear in hidden cache on a certain level with more info placed in somebody's locker... so ya make it more interesting to find stuff and explore a bit.

I'm tired and think my brain is now broken from thinking too much after getting lack of sleep.

[Eileen Collinson]

I like Runeblade's ideas. I liked the techbase feel of DOOM 3's levels, and I feel like going outside would be cool (though if it's gonna be in Earth, I have no damn clue how they won't go outside).

[Amanda savory]

Hell was excellent, never have I played a game that captured the look and feel of hell to such a high caliber...not even Diablo.

Well in terms of going outside briefly and then having to go in, I think it was by the game designers choice. Its a psychological mind screwer. To know that you just came out of a dark and hell ridden place, to the daylight of a barren planet, knowing that you cannot stay out in the light forever because you'll run out of air and die, forcing you to go back into that hell. They didn't have to do it at all, but they chose to for the thriller aspect.

I enjoyed doom 3's monsters as well, some of them had a little bit too much of Quake 2 feel, but I was okay with that because i'm a fan of the (early) quake series. In terms of placing cyber demons all over the map, I couldn't disagree with that more. Cyber demon was first and foremost a boss in DOOM 1. DOOM 2 and plutonia at times seemed like a big tech demo in which the game designers often threw in these sweet bosses because it fit the maps needs, disregarding what these bosses stood for in the previous game. I say bring back the baron of hell and spam him everywhere.

Since DOOM 3 is a reboot in the series, i'd assume that DOOM 4 will be a reboot to hell on earth. In which case, it'll be epic. Despite what i've said about DOOM 2, its still my favorite out of the classic ones.

[Umpyre Records]

Are we 100% sure it's going to be set on Earth? What about Earth's moon? If the UAC have a base on Mars, then wouldn't they have an older one on the moon itself? I think that would make an interesting setting, but not for an entire game but for a section.

Yeah Mikedzines, hell was indeed excellent. I would replay Doom 3 just to get to play the Hell maps again. As for the cyberdemons, I don't want them all over the place either. Just a few encounters with the first being maybe half way through or later. Also agree with you, they should bring back the Baron of Hell.

They should also use the pinky demon more but I would prefer one more like the older version minus the metal rear end.

Oh crap, now I got to go to the real hell and scraqe old paint of a shed in heat. bah.

[Pants]

Oh crap, now I got to go to the real hell and scraqe old paint of a shed in heat. bah.

A shed... in heat? How... how does that even happen?


Erm... Anyway...

I think actually they might be fine using the cyberdemons often.

Perhaps on Nightmare difficulty they can use them at a scale similar to Plutonia.

[Sammi Jones]

Hmmm I'm not sure I want to know why I said 'shed in heat' now.


Maybe they could sneak in a cyberdemon with dual launchers.

[josie treuberg]

Some of the things that bugged me about Doom 3 included the lack of windows and the silly air-tanks. You have one of the coolest looking settings in the entire solar system with a high tech base sitting on the surface and lets leave out 99% of the windows, except for a couple and a skylight or two. Hmmm ok... I guess I was the only one who wanted to see more of the surface and to pass by more windows and get more of that atmospheric feeling of being on Mars. Then to make it even more weird, lets go outside BUT you only have 20 secs of air in an air tank so... when you do get outside RUN to get back inside again. No... please I don't leik this idea at all. I wanted to explore more of the surface. So you know, if they have part of Doom 4 on another planet, they should you know... have the UAC architects realize that glass isn't really all that rare. heh. I suppose they left the windows out in Doom 3 because they wanted the place all dark and dreary. Maybe my brain is broken and D3 actually had more windows than I recall.

This might come as a surprise to you, but humans can't actually breathe the atmosphere of Mars. I'm not entirely sure making you don a big spacesuit with extra oxygen tanks to explore more of the surroundings would have made the game any more enjoyable.

Doom 3 was mostly about the cramped and claustrophobic surroundings, open outside environments would have added nothing to that.

One thing is for sure. We all played D3 and didn't see a cyberdemon until... and then had to kill it... well you know if ye played it and personally I just didn't like that at all. I hope to hell that Doom 4 has more cyberdemons in various places and you can use whatever weapon you want.. if you have the ammo you have the means. I mean come on, I want to be walking along and hear that waking up noise and the evil stomping about or get a rocket or two suddenly blow me up.

I really fail to see how extreme http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/VillainDecay due to http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ConservationOfNinjutsu?from=Main.ConservationOfNinjitsu would improve the game.

[Ria dell]

I really fail to see how extreme http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/VillainDecay due to http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ConservationOfNinjutsu?from=Main.ConservationOfNinjitsu would improve the game.

Conservation of Ninjutsu doesn't apply to rockets, you know. One rocket hurts like a [censored]. Two rockets hurt twice as much. You can't really villain decay a piece of explosive ordnance, bud. It still can two shot. If there's two cyberdemons, you're proper screwed unless you strafe.

Besides, then by your standards, Cybie's already been villain decayed. Plutonia. Q-E-Duh. Or, you know, Episodes 3 and 4 if you wanna get serious about this.

...Why, yes, I know the positions of all the Cyberdemons in Doom 1, Doom 2, Plutonia, and TNT. Well, not really for the last two. There were too many on Go 2 It alone for me to count.

[Kanaoka]

Conservation of Ninjutsu doesn't apply to rockets, you know. One rocket hurts like a [censored]. Two rockets hurt twice as much. You can't really villain decay a piece of explosive ordnance, bud. It still can two shot. If there's two cyberdemons, you're proper screwed unless you strafe.

Not the rockets, the Cyberdeamons!

No matter how dangerous they are, the more of them there are, the less important each one will be.

Besides, then by your standards, Cybie's already been villain decayed. Plutonia. Q-E-Duh. Or, you know, Episodes 3 and 4 if you wanna get serious about this.

...Why, yes, I know the positions of all the Cyberdemons in Doom 1, Doom 2, Plutonia, and TNT. Well, not really for the last two. There were too many on Go 2 It alone for me to count.

...and I didn't think it was a good idea there either.

[Eduardo Rosas]

I've been a huge Doom fan since the early 90's
Remember getting the first demo of Doom 1 and playing it every day, then one day i had the real thing

every year i play doom 2, at least 2 times
Zdoom, Gldoom loved them all

When doom 3 came out i was as happy as a doom geek can be, i was just finished with the army
Spent a good amount of cash on a new computer and got myself a pre-order of doom 3
installed it and looked over my bad ass T-shirt

I started playing the game and after 4 hours i was bored

In my honest opinion Doom 3 was horrible, now i cant really feel "fear" to a game or a movie so the jumping out of walls stuff really did not add anything
Nor did the flashlight really bother me that much, heck it was easy going back and forth

But the game play was for me just too consolised
Slow repetitive and easy
even on the the harder difficulties

1 hour into the game and you knew where the next "zombie, imp, thing" was going to jump at you from

I did finish it and i did buy the expansion pack

I hated the marine i played due to well his face, i wanted my space marine with the mask and armor
Give us that back please

The movements where sluggish the AI was not really that good and i know some people "fear" games or... get the feeling of terror playing games
But even so
Doom was for me never about fear or terror
It was about blasting zombies and demons, it was about finding items and keys
It was about finding big frackin guns

The doom space marine was faceless, voiceless and bad ass
give us him back

There is a reason to why Doom 1 and 2 is installed on my portable computer, my main computer and my phone
and Doom 3 is left alone

Harsh first post sorry, but i really did not enjoy doom 3 at all
and i hope Doom 4 will be better

[Ebou Suso]

In my honest opinion Doom 3 was horrible, now i cant really feel "fear" to a game or a movie so the jumping out of walls stuff really did not add anything
Nor did the flashlight really bother me that much, heck it was easy going back and forth

But the game play was for me just too consolised
Slow repetitive and easy
even on the the harder difficulties

Now that is just a ridiculous statement, as if Doom 1&2 weren't repetitive and extremely simple. Left, right, shoot was all there was to it. You didn't even have to worry about this whole Z-axis because the whole game was on a 2D plane made to look like 3D.

1 hour into the game and you knew where the next "zombie, imp, thing" was going to jump at you from

Are you saying Doom 1&2 offered more surprises?

The movements where sluggish the AI was not really that good

As opposed to the original games, where the enemies only had one single thought in their head: Move towards player and shoot?

and i know some people "fear" games or... get the feeling of terror playing games
But even so
Doom was for me never about fear or terror
It was about blasting zombies and demons, it was about finding items and keys
It was about finding big frackin guns

Wait, so you're saying Doom was never about horror, yet you complain about Doom 3 not having enough horror?

Does not compute.

I hated the marine i played due to well his face, i wanted my space marine with the mask and armor
Give us that back please

The doom space marine was faceless, voiceless and bad ass
give us him back

Wait, when did the player character in Doom 3 ever speak?

And he tore up a whole base filled with deamons, then invaded hell and kicked the behind of the cyberdeamon, y'know, exactly what the guy in Doom 1 did. How can he be more badass than that?

There is a reason to why Doom 1 and 2 is installed on my portable computer, my main computer and my phone
and Doom 3 is left alone

You have one of the most severe cases of Rose-tinted Goggles I've ever come across. Everyone will always think what they liked when they were kids is the supreme entertainment that none of the current garbage will ever measure up to. Fact of the matter is, if you had never heard of it, and started playing it today, you'd think it svcked.

In the words of Yahtzee: "Nostalgia is like stuffing your mouth with cocaine-infused marbles; it makes you say stupid things!".

[Cameron Garrod]

This might come as a surprise to you, but humans can't actually breathe the atmosphere of Mars. I'm not entirely sure making you don a big spacesuit with extra oxygen tanks to explore more of the surroundings would have made the game any more enjoyable.

I don't see why you would assume that I would think humans can breathe on Mars. HEH This might come as a surprise to you but the air tank technology of today allows you to breath for many minutes... up to some hours of time and I'm sure the UAC in the future could match that if not improve on it... blah blah blah. Anyhow MY POINT IS that I want to explore my environment, and I don't think that is unreasonable. If you prefer to rush through things then go right ahead... don't need a air tank with 2 secs of air for that.

[yermom]

Hey guys.

Found this article. Kinda big news.

http://www.thatvideogameblog.com/2010/08/11/carmack-doom-4-shouldnt-take-as-long-as-rage/

"it shouldn’t take as long to ship as Rage. It’s already in the pipeline and we feel good about it.”

I'm really feeling a DOOM 4 reveal at this year's quake con. :hehe:

[Jessica Lloyd]

Hey guys.

Found this article. Kinda big news.

http://www.thatvideogameblog.com/2010/08/11/carmack-doom-4-shouldnt-take-as-long-as-rage/



I'm really feeling a DOOM 4 reveal at this year's quake con. :hehe:

All hail John Carmack, most exalted!

Oh, man. This is gonna be great.

[YO MAma]

I don't see why you would assume that I would think humans can breathe on Mars. HEH This might come as a surprise to you but the air tank technology of today allows you to breath for many minutes... up to some hours of time and I'm sure the UAC in the future could match that if not improve on it... blah blah blah. Anyhow MY POINT IS that I want to explore my environment, and I don't think that is unreasonable. If you prefer to rush through things then go right ahead... don't need a air tank with 2 secs of air for that.

Yes indeed! Space marine armour would have a hookup for whatever kinds of tanks are common around Mars and those would be fill-able at airlocks. Instead we get to run around in the dirt hoping some idiot dropped five tanks in a row so we can make it to the other door. Like you said, tanks can hold a fair amount of oxygen. Let us explore. The game was even advertised as one we're supposed to explore. Contrary to Lcars' belief, it would certainly break up the monotony of silver corridor, dark room, monster closet, pickup, rinse repeat. A segment in a rover could be neat too. The arcade-like segments in different roles worked surprisingly well in Dead Space.

I suspect a lot of the lack of bigger exploration was just the design giving in to the team's inability to make the engine truly shine on the machines common at the time. The same was true of the first generation of games using the Quake engine (including Quake). Everything was even more claustrophobic than DooM.

And I agree on secrets. Bring them back. For that matter, bring back non-linear maps with confusing objectives and not two, but ten ways to approach all the killing. Classic DooM had a glorious set of secrets that took me months to work out as a kid. E1M3 was the shinging star there I think. So many areas that were visible early on turned out to be awesome secrets. One was obviously a secret (the soul sphere in the window).

[Nitol Ahmed]

Yeah Aliotroph? that's spot on with the marines armor. They wouldn't have some stupid bulky space suit like some NASA thing. If the UAC can design teleporters and put a high tech base on Mars, they sure as hell can come up with a better rebreather / armor / suit combination. Hell they could have some sci-fi air cell tech that isn't even a tank if the developers wanted. Bulky suits and huge air-tanks be gone. heh

Also agree with you about the linear approach to rooms. They need to allow you more freedom in approaching any room and allow you to attack from different places. Obviously there will be places where you only have one approach to a room but sometimes have a choice makes for more interesting gameplay. I would also like to see you be able to go to more different maps due to what exit you took.

That soul sphere secret you mentioned remains as one of the most memorable secrets in gaming for me. That sure beat the hell out of armor shards under some steps.

[Eilidh Brian]

Hey guys.

Found this article. Kinda big news.

http://www.thatvideogameblog.com/2010/08/11/carmack-doom-4-shouldnt-take-as-long-as-rage/



I'm really feeling a DOOM 4 reveal at this year's quake con. :hehe:

We should hear about it here pretty quickly. Both Nick and Gstaff are down there until Sunday.

[Rich O'Brien]

We should hear about it here pretty quickly. Both Nick and Gstaff are down there until Sunday.

It should be interesting to see what they have to say about it or what is revealed or whatever..

By the way, if my cyberdemon gets villain decay will his his metal hoof fall off?

[Sarah Knight]

Yes indeed! Space marine armour would have a hookup for whatever kinds of tanks are common around Mars and those would be fill-able at airlocks. Instead we get to run around in the dirt hoping some idiot dropped five tanks in a row so we can make it to the other door. Like you said, tanks can hold a fair amount of oxygen. Let us explore. The game was even advertised as one we're supposed to explore. Contrary to Lcars' belief, it would certainly break up the monotony of silver corridor, dark room, monster closet, pickup, rinse repeat. A segment in a rover could be neat too. The arcade-like segments in different roles worked surprisingly well in Dead Space.

As always, trying to boil a complex game down to one single sentence will always be highly unfair to the game in question.

There was nothing wrong with Doom 3 being rather linear and only indoors, it worked. Of course, one may want more exploration and open world environments, but that wouldn't have worked, because the claustrophobic sense would have been completely lost.

This isn't Halo 3, which you seem to want it to be, it's Doom.