After having deep cleaning done with half assed pain killers, I now know that brushing teeth is no joke. That's not a nagging, that's golden advice on improving quality of your life

I like Fallout 3 GOTY. It's what I'm currently playing right now. The world in Fallout 3 has more to explore and it is less buggy. I like FO:NV and FO3 almost equally. New Vegas feels more like Fallout 1& 2 and it's made by Obsidian.

Yes, apples and oranges can truly be compared as fruit. Watch, I'll show you:

Oranges are born from the tree citrus sinensis, apples are fruit born from the malus domesticus tree. Both have been cultivated to sweetness some time in prehistoric, ancient societies.

Oranges are known as a citrus fruit. Apples are more fleshy, containing much less juice than an orange.

I just compared the fruit orange to the fruit apple.

It is entirely possible to compare apples to oranges, when you are comparing one fruit to another fruit.

It is a matter of focus. Comparing Skyrim to New Vegas is possible, when you are comparing concepts that exist in both.
It is NOT possible to compare concepts that exist in only 1 game.

I was comparing characters/story. Both have characters and story. Just those 2 areas. It is valid. It comparing fruit to fruit.

I am not a politician. You are the one dancing.

Oh i remember that i laughed about the Miner as i mentioned Deathclaws. I took my Pistol and runned straight down the road and started shooting at them and though i am missing them. So i started to run away from them but they were just too fast. Thanks to Autosave my last save game was in the middle of the fight against the Deathclaws. ^^

So does this mean that when fallout 4 comes out and bethesda works on it again it's going to end up being a PoS? Because after new vegas fallout fans might explode at a dumbed down fallout game, if you think TES fans rage wait till fallout fans do O.O Sigh....I dream of a world where bethesda designs the world and obsidian does the story and dialong and characters and pretty much everything else.

But anyway on topic. I came directly off of New Vegas to Skyrim and it's immediately noticable how very little bethesda paid attention to NV, there was soooooo much they could have learned from it and they just blatantly ignored every advancement or innovation NV had, it's actually kind of a let down Hopefully dlc makes Skyrim better than it is because I haven't touched it in weeks. (of course I'm on xbox so the vanilla game gets boring REALLY fast, gotta buy a pc so mods can come to my rescue)

STALKER rips a new one in New Vegas on atmosphere alone. And I'm talking the orginal, not just the sequels.

It's hard for me to take a topic like this seriously, because you really can't compare two games in complete different worlds with complete different themes.

So, they based the game on Van Buren as well as Fallout 3 (I recall reading that some of the tribals and Caesar's Legion were also from Van Buren). That's all I said, dude. I didn't say they copy pasted everything. But thanks for reiterating my point.

I'm sorry, but you are not allowed to use logic in this forum.

Yes you can, when you are comparing characteristics shared by both. Both games have npc followers. I was comparing the NPC followers in New Vegas, with the NPC followers in Skyrim.

I wasn't comparing the world setting or theme of New Vegas with Skyrim. Just the NPC followers. In New Vegas, all of your followers had fully fleshed out personalities, with history and quests with consequences for you and that character. Skyrim's followers don't really have much of a personality or history. They're just there.

Both games are awesome.

well since i am more of a TES Fan then a fallout fan i got to say i love skyrim more.
And i agree with that about followers. I mean Lydia for example doesnt even have a personality x) or a soul...

WHY CAN'T PEOPLE LIKE BOTH GAMES?!

*Calms self down*

I see this discussion over and over on both the Fallout and TES forums.

New Vegas is Skyrim's achilles heel and vice versa. You cannot have the depth of interaction and quest outcome of New Vegas without... well.... not having many quests. In Skyrim the player is encouraged to explore the world and "happen to" quests, dungeons, caves, etc. Some of the best content in Skyrim is hidden in a journal clutched in the hands of a skeleton deep in a cave that no quest sent you to. The promise of Radiant Story is that future games will eventually be able to dynamically add content not crafted by designers, but in response to player actions.

New Vegas, on the other hand, features incredibly deep and varied quests that are all incredibly well written and acted. Quest lines would close off and open dependent on the player's actions and choices; and faction loyalty. It's incredibly engrossing... it's just that there isn't much else to do in the world that isn't dependent on having a quest in my pipboy.

Skyrim and New Vegas are both fantastic games, they are just designed around different paradigms. Skyrim is a game where the player "happens to" the world, it's a fantasy sandbox. New Vegas, on the other hand, "happens to" the player. Even though it appears to be an open game, it's more constricted and linear that it appears.

Even though it's a different game, I would have appreciated if Skyrim had brought some concepts from NV: like deeper companions, a deeper persuasion system (after using almost every skill in conversation in NV, Skyrim seems downright dated in comparison), and even a slight notion that other NPCs react to your actions (If you tell Caesar you won't help him, you'd better watch out, but if you tell Ulfric you won't help him, he says "the offer is still on the table").

Sure, but you have to remember that the scale of FO games is much smaller than TES games. This is one of the benefits Fallout gets. Due to being set in a smaller game world, they don't have to put as many NPCs in and can focus more on depth. If Skyrim were to have the same NPC depths as let's say FO:NV, it would take much longer to develop and release.

Of course, I log a lot more hours into TES than I do FO, even if some may consider TES a more watery game series (or atleast Skyrim).

True though, it would be a great addition to the series if they could include the best of both worlds. I wouldn't mind waiting out that extra developing time.

Isn't that game just coming out of beta?

Nah, Skyrims still in beta.

Really? It plays just fine for me.

I'll wait to compair NV + DLC to Skyrim when Skyrim get's it's dlc as well.

Though I already vote NV, I have to say that's a damn fine idea. Who knows, maybe Team Howard's writers will come out of that collective stroke and write some darn good characters and story. I won't get my hopes up, but you hold a respectable view.

It's a stretch, a big one.
Skyrims DLC will most likely be big, and full of scaled loot with meaningless quests to top it off.

My biggest beef with Skyrim was that it failed to grasp any of the elements which were so popular in NV and put em into skyrim.
There is NO reason why somthing soooooooo simple yet vital as the companion wheel couldn't be added into skyrim. Seriously, how long would that take to add it.... a week? Tops.
I can live with the removal of point placing, but not having dialoge which draws you in and makes you care for the people around you is flat out unacceptable..... especially in a game which claims to be an RPG.
I don't know if Todd just likes to throw crap at people or if he's simply too stubborn to realize that all he needs to do is hire just ONE writer who made it past the 3rd grade. Yea yea yea, BGS creates worlds that make you cream your pants, so why can't those amazing worlds be filled with people who actually leave an impression on you? Where is it written that if your good at one thing you can't be good at another?

Skyrim had me waiting for a solid 2 years of nail biting anticipation, only to be greeted with a 13yrolds wet dream: huge world, enemies that never get anymore difficult, horribad writing so go ahead n skip right through it cause your not missing ANYTHING, no "confusing" things like point placing, and....... Dun dunna dun. A dragon. <---- this is where all the 5yroldz start screaming in excitement.
It was such a shock to me, especially after playing such a well put together game like NV, that all those vital RPG elements were simply left out to dry. It honestly makes me sad thinking of what an amazing world I could be living in if BGS put a solid 6 months into their writing/ story. I honestly don't think my Speech skill ever hit 25, not like it mattered as the only time it was used was in "sales" dialoge. That's just pathetic.

Let me just stop any grease ball BGS die-harder from accusing me of not playing the game, I sure as hell did(and occasionally try to)
My first char had roughly 170hrs, hit the lvl 50 mark. I finished the pathetic MQ, along with the guild quests(well untill that nightingale chick glitched out n wouldn't go to the thieves guild) and a good chunk of side quests along with all the Daedric quest which were the best IMO because they actually made you think about what you were doing.
My 2nd(and last) char only hit the 40hr mark, but I was only focused on die hard RPing a thief. It wasnt so successful as the game isint set up to accommodate a player who wishes to use a quick tongue over a big shiny sword. I will say, that the game really has some very fun aspects to it when playing the sneaky type, aswell as looking sixy as hell in leather armor/ nightingale armor.

The companions were pathetic, at best. All of them could have been mercs for all I know, as none of em had any story to explore nor anyway to connect to em(things that are a must for someone tryn to RP)
No single person grabbed my attention in Skyrim, and that's a sad sad fact.

I give this game soooooo much crap, not because I hate it but because it has so much potential. I like Skyrim, I really do. I simply don't like it as an RPG, it's as a hack n slash dungeon crawler that I like it, one that has oddly placed in *some RPG elements.

All I can ask is they don't treat Fallout: 4 the same way they treated TES. I will honestly shed a tear if "Speech" has no place in it..... Please Todd, just hire some new writers or just have Obsidian approve it before it's released.

There is a massive difference in the dynamics of Fallout 3/FNV and Skyrim.

Quite a lot of the 'extras' which made FNV good value were actually suggestions made by players about Fallout 3...particularly the 'hardcoe' mode. Beth picked up on those and ran with them, but moulded them onto the differing situation and theme in FNV, and came up with a good combination. As such, FNV still had the basic F3 model of 'survival being the thing', and moulding your character into the storyline.

Skyrim is somewhat different, in that the gutsy desperation of just simply surviving doesn't exist to the same extent, and rather than your character moulding into the story, in Skyrim your character IS the story. And that is part of the reason why players can develop uber characters through power-leveling or grinding early on in the game.

(The other aspect was that in F3/FNV, it wasn't so much that most characters were hard to kill, it was that they generally were able to kill first and faster than the opposition - defence through superior offence...if you stuffed up, you died just as easilly at level 30 as you did at level 1).

New vegas had better followers and thats about it, extremely outdated poor engine, 3 voice actors, terrible bugs and very frequent freezes even on fresh save files makes me glad I eventually smashed the disc on the floor.

Skyrim is such a more satisfying experience.

Vegas does offer better in terms of dialog. Yesman and Mr Fantastic were a riot. I have just bought the New Vegas Ultimate edition that comes with all the DLC. Hopefully the DLCs are even more hilarious.

I am basically taking break from Skyrim for a while after 560 hours in total to give the mods some time to surprise me.

However i will need some time to get back into NV because Skyrim is still 10 times better looking, even after downloading 7 GB worth of NV texture packs.

OWB is the funny one, the rest are serious.
The story on them though is the best writing seen in a long time.