Fallout: New Vegas seems a bit more immersive to me. The way all of the followers had their own quest line. A fully fleshed-out personality, the end result of which was up to the player, and changed the follower permanently. You knew who they were, and why they were following you. What they're goals were for following you. And you could steer them a direction. You could interact with them more, as personalities. That made the simulation more immersive to me.

I don't know where Lydia is from. I don't know anything about who she is, or what her goals are. I don't understand why she's so willing to die for me. That she's doing it "for honor" is just a cop-out. She never says that. And anyway, why is she doing it for "honor" if that's the reason? I want a story of why honor is so important to her.

You knew who Cass, Boone and Veronica were, and what they hoped to gain or achieve by following you. You could help them, or not. And if you did help them, you could affect their outcome.

Hell, all the NPCs in NV seemed to have more depth. Farkus and Aela (in Skyrim) seem to have a bit more depth than many of the other followers. You know WHY they are following you at least. And you know a little about who they are. But it still pales when compared with the characters of NV.

Some of the College followers...you do a favor for them and they follow you to death. With the favor in question providing only a skeletal sketch of who they are and what they want. And then there are those who do it just for money. They seem to have some unique scripted lines to say (over and over), and that's about it.

hardcoe mode of NV greatly enhanced the immersion also. Food, water and sleep were important and It felt real. And while crafting mostly amounted to weapon modification, repair and bullet reloading, that made sense. Don't care who you are, you aren't going to build a plasma rifle, assault rifle or sub-machinegun from scratch. But you might be able to make it better, with a modular modification. You could stuff bullets with a little more powder. It's not illogical.

Don't get me wrong, I love Skyrim. Been playing it non-stop for a couple of months now. I just think that the devs for Elder Scrolls could learn some more about immersion from the devs for Fallout: New Vegas, for Elder Scrolls VI. If there is one. And I hope there is.

Well obviously since there is so much more followers in Skyrim they can't be as detailed as the 8 or how many were in FNV

Sooo...is this a NV discussion, or a Skyrim discussion?

That's because Bethesda didn't actually work on New Vegas. Obsidian entertainment did. Their writers are simply more talented, and their design tends more toward the old school, as many of their team were responsible for stuff such as Icewind Dale, Planescape, Fallout 1/2 etc.

If you are trying to say that Skyrim could learn a little from New Vegas then sure, I agree.

Quantity over quality...good idea.

There is no incentive to pick one follower over the other in Skyrim, though. Maybe only their specialization (tank or archer or caster or..). They're all cardboard cut-outs and add little to your journey beyond their occasional "ooh" and "aah" and obviously their help in combat (and even that isn't always very good). So then what is the point of having a larger selection?

Anyway, NV overall was much greater both in terms of story and quest depth. Nearly all characters I encountered except for the generic "Bandit" or "Guard" ones had a story to tell.

Both games have a different focus. Bethesda took Fallout 3 in a more TES direction, with less quality but more quantity. Obsidian brought Fallout back to its roots by being more about quality. So we get a smaller cast with more personality as well as more structured storyline. Of course at the same time they added some invisible walls to make sure we experience the story the way they designed it.

So this isn't a question of what is better designed, as both studios are very talented, it is just preference. I usually prefer Bethesda although with Skyrim quests did seem to loose a bit too much of their personality. They were just cliché fetch this, kill this quests with no good motivation behind them to make you interested. However I wouldn't say FO:NV was better, it had too much of its own issues, some being worse than Skyrim's (but that is just my opinion).

I would've glady taken far fewer potential followers had it meant a deeper story behind who they were and what they were about. This has been one of my major complaints about Skyrim so far. Bethesda has utterly failed in the companion/follower category, writing and quests as well, but...well...that's another story, and off toipic.

I agree. The game in general feels like a cardboard cut out. Amazing game world. Boring quests and characters. I don't even bother with followers because they're about as engaging, intelligent and useful as someone trying to sell you a phone upgrade. I think Cicero is the only character I've encountered in my 200 hours of play, that is vaguely interesting, unique and has a good back story.

Skyrim is the worst sequel to Hunt the Wumpus I have ever seen

AH! I knew it was allot of the same team from Fallout 1 and 2, but I didn't know they had Icewind Dale and Planescape: Torment veterans as well. Planescape and Icewind had great characters and characterization. I think we could use more of this, and less mechanics. If there has to be a choice between the 2, that is. I'd love to have both.

I also feel like the stock game textures were higher resolution than that in Skyrim.

The loot seems more thought out, and the trait system far surpasses "racial bonuses" that don't do anything rather than extremely passive nothingnesses.

Bethesda focused more on the world and less in stories and Obsidia more on stories and less in the world.
There is no factual better or worse because they were made with different things in mind. The fact that which one you like more is subjective. Personally i enjoyed New Vegas great quests/companions a lot, but for me it didn't have as much replayability as Skyrims amazing world and it shows on the hours i have spent on the games.

@AureusPotestas
Most of Fallout NVs textures came from FO3 and they were the same size as Skyrims. Though they probably were less compressed than Skyrims textures which makes them less blurry.

Skyrim has a very nice skeleton, but the devs either forgot or don't have the time to flesh it out.

Yeah, it doesn't make a lot of sense that some of the characters will say, kill their own mother and then say "well I've got nothing better to do, might as well follow you!"
Bethesda is basically Bob Dylan to Obsidian's Jimi Hendrix. Beth made a great game (like Along the Watchtower BD) and then Obsidian came along, took what Beth had done and put in all the little bits to make it fun and meaningful. Maybe not the best simile, but you get what I mean. I would love it if they gave Skyrim to some real story tellers. You hear about other companies getting real writers for their stories - anyone remember Betrayal at Krondor, or there's that new game Champions of Amur (?) from RA Salvatore.

One day...

You know the excuse of so many followers is the reason why the back ground is not fleshed out like New Vegas is complete HOGWASH. Skyrim was being worked on by what over a 100 people? 100 people in 5 years and this is what they come up with? Sadly Bethesda isn't as talented as Obsidian is. Look what they did with New Vegas in what 2 years or less and made a very immersive game. Yes they svck with invisible walls but besides that using a buggy engine that was created by Bethesta they did a remarkable job.

Todd should be proud and ashamed at the same time. Proud in what Obsidian did in making an awsome game like New Vegas and ashamed they made half a game like New Vegas with more resources and man power. I love Skyrim, I think it's one of the best games ever, but since Todd loves to spew crap out of his mouth, I expected more so this is hwere he should be ashamed.

Todd doesn't live up to his hype sadly. He breaks too many promises. Funny a guy who can mock the commuinty that loves him so much, he should be able to aleast put stand up to his claims. Sadly he can't. Skyrim should have been such more better than it was on release.

Betheshda has only been working on skyrim for 3 and Maybe 4 years, anything before that was concept, pre-development and such.
Not to mention most of the game was made from scratch and all the work on the engine.
Obsidian took maybe less time and less people, but they had the entire engine and a lot of textures and models ready to go when they began.

Skyrim is maybe not as in depth as FA:NV, but obsidian had much more time to flesh out their world without having to concern themselves with creating every single texture, model or even the game engine.

Skyrim was being work on as soon as Oblivion was done. Again that is what Todd said unless he was lieing to us again.

Again, Bethesda has what over 100 people or at least over 50 people now working on One game. I don't think Obsidian had that many. So while the textures and engine and what not was being worked on, the story telling people could have been working well actuall stories.

You trying to tell me that the person who makes the textures and moels also writes the stories? In 3 or even as you say 4 years (more like 5 but I will give you the benifit of the doubt) in 3 years, those stories could have been really fleshed out. Bethesda blew it simply as that. For alot of the quests in Skyrim Bethesda blew it. Come on you telling me in 3 years this is what they came up with for the "mages" quest?

Obsidian are fantastic story tellers. Bethesda are fantastic at creating open worlds. FO;NV was a marriage of the two which is why it was such a good game. Hopefully Bethesda will use Obsidian again.

I'm not sure Bethesda would allow any outside dev's to work on TES, but they should allow Obsidian to create an expansion for Skyrim, while they get on with FO4.

Why not?

Some of the 'many' followers in Skyrim are simply mercenaries you hire in a bar. Story told, others are assigned to you as servant. Weak, but acceptable. There should be some followers though that have a point, that have a story that makes the main character want to use them, want to keep them alive. I would also have liked them to tell you a bit about themselves like in NV - "I prefer heavy armour, long walks on the beach and dual weapons. Oh and please don't use me as a pack guar. Not that there's any reason to know what a guar is..."

I was heart-broken when feandel was Killed by me by mistake.

Everyone knows New Vegas did a lot of stuff better so its sad the progression didnt continue.

-Better characters
-Better follower commands
-Better dialogue system/more dialogue
-Better quests
-More choices to make
-Haircuts to change facial hair appearance
-Marked followers on map
-Better faction system
-Multiple endings.

Still waiting for NV to hit the bargin bin before playing it... the fact that it's "on sale" for $33 on steam shows that it's a game with legs.