Chinese Remnants. Now that the Enclave is gone, hey looks like a good time to come out of hiding and conquer stupid Americans. Then the Enclave is all like, nuh uh [censored]es we purposely looked like we died so we could bait you. NCR and Legion are all like omfg wtf as they get annihilated by hidden Chinese Nukes just for this purpose. The game takes place after this mini war, and a new apocalypse is upon the west coast with even greater mutations taking place due to a second spike in radiation.

Edit
Hell even just Chinese Remnants as long as they have crazy technology. We need a large, old, powerful faction that looks like they can strike anywhere and strike fear into anyone. The Enclave is dead, but unless a similar faction arises there's just no tension in the games. Legion are primitives, and the NCR seems too much like a typical government to be really afraid of. Hell, even the Brotherhood of Steel going ape[censored] on the NCR with some secret weapon and finding a stockpile of vertibirds.

well they can replace em but they need to be replaced with an equivelant type of faction, the enclave were ominous, menacing and would show up almost anywhere, they put up a decent fight, had some firepower, they had a lot of high tech, used vertibirds, and new vegas doesn't have any faction near as good as the enclave, no factions really have any high tech, somehow the fiends have all the energy weapons, ceasers legion is the worst faction is the history of fallout, mainly using macheties and they live in tents? oy vey, and ncr is pretty bad also, its ok to take the enclave out if you actually replace them with a cool faction, but to replace em with ceasers legion and ncr, that turned out to be a dud i think.

Enclave? Again? (And this topic? Again?)

Mother of Mercy, they're already in the same boat as Team Rocket from Pokemon. People are not gonna take them seriously if they come back (again).

I called The Presidential HQ by the way. They said "You win every time. We're not playing with you anymore.".

I myself love how you think the Enclave are destroyed. There is still several parts of the US that have not bin in Fallout games. So how can you say they are wiped out when you havent even explored 75% of the US...? Just because they were in the West and East doesnt mean there not in North-east,South-east, Mid west, or etc.

@Westoftherockies i Agree if your going to Replace the Enclave you GOT to replace them with someone equivalent.

I myself love how you haven't quoted or said any reason why, just that they're more to explain so obviously there must be more there. Explain.

1. The Enclave's plan was to kill everyone with a virus, so any Enclave not aboard the Oil Rig would die.

2. All the Remnants say that the Enclave's leadership collapsed after the Oil Rig, if there were more Enclave then they wouldn't have been a collapse of leadership, they would have just moved to that new base.

Just two reasons why there cannot be another Enclave stronghold, just because they were the pre-war government doesn't mean they have dozens of bases everywhere. They had one plan and it failed.

not sure why you don't like the enclave, but there are no factions equivelant to the enclave. lets compare...

enclave >> high tech, used vertibirds, energy weapons, bots, were menacing, would show up almost anywhere, used good tactics

ceasers legion >> live in tents, use macheties mostly, never showed up on the map hardly anywhere, no tactics whatsoever

ncr >>> no high tech either, mostly poorly armed with service rifles, once again no tactics, they don't really patrol anywhere.

And you dont think they have more plans?? Theres always a plan B...and i love it when a plan comes together. :goodjob:. Plus You dont know how many bases they have your just assuming.

Yeah and I have given actual reasons why I think that they're no more secret Enclave strongholds.

ugh....you dont know...you JUST DONT ok. LET me say this again NO ONE knows how many of them are left, how many bunkers they have(if any), Where there at, and when they will come back or not. Yah your giving real reasons from the game but that still doesnt prove anything yet.

I've got to agree that the Enclave as a power is gone. Sure there may be a small bunker somewhere in Chicago and some survivors from the Capitol Wasteland could have escaped. Perhaps they joined the bunker Enclave remnants in Chicago. I suspect that at most the possible Chicago bunker may be the same size as the Mojave BoS chapter but I doubt it'd be any bigger than that. I wouldn't be surprised if in Fallout 4 or 5 etc we'd come across some secret base in the far North or something.... Maybe the Enclave fled to the Moon and built a base there rebuilding their strength and biding their time mwah ha ha (just trying to think like Bethesda here :shifty: )

I'm sorry to see the Enclave gone and that BoS is so small in the Mojave. I love Power Armour and energy weapons, the sinister Enclave etc. I really missed them in New Vegas (I know they were there but their presence was just so small). I just really don't like the NCR or the Legion, can't stand them. Fallout just isn't the same for me without the BoS and the Enclave. I need Power Armour and advanced energy weapons in my Fallout.

So if it can't be 100% proved anything can happen, established canon is just a big free-for-all :shrug:, that's a kind of silly stupid way to look at everything don't you think?

It's not about whether I like them or not (And I really liked them back in FO2. They were the first "grey" faction I've seen in a game.) But using the same faction over and over and over (notice three overs) again would feel so... forced. How about a new antagonist? Let's get some creativity in here. Or we can tie up the loose ends with other factions. Brotherhood is at war with NCR as far as we know (for all you tech-lovers out there). Caesar's Legion is still large towards east (come along my good Romans!). NCR has great potential for plot twists (Nation-wide rebellion anyone?).

It doesn't have to be a whole faction either. House was a brilliant addition to the game and he caused more than enough problems for NCR. Adding even a single character can cover the bad-guy need (Not necessarily bad though, in House's case. You happy Colonel? :tongue: ).

Now you're probably gonna say "Hey you're using the same factions over and over again too!". Well we didn't nuke any of them twice did we?

Lore says they're gone. At the most there might be a few stragglers out there, like the Remnants in New Vegas but thats your lot. The Enclave is cool and popular so lore will likely be forgotten becuase people like The Enclave. I really wouldn't be surprised if they did pop up in a future game even though it wouldn't make sense (I mean returning as a great power not as a couple of guys in their Grandfathers Power Armour). I think people wouldn't want them back all the time if they were replaced with something that was just as cool or interesting. I know that depends on taste etc it's just for me the NCR and Legion can't replace the Enclave. The Remnants in New Vegas just whet my appetite for them.

no not really no one knows what gonna happen and you shouldnt say stuff that a certain faction is gone unless you have the hardcoe proof of it.

Here's the thing. They were blown up three times and zapped by Optimus twice. Don't you think it's absurd to flog them around? Sure they're cool, but it's time to just say "look, they're gone now. We killed these guys, so let's come up with something new".

What about someone like Viktor Presper? Someone who goes mad and wants to destroy the world with FEV? What about a communist/ socialist faction that restores a power armor plant? That would be an excellent opposition to the NCR. What if Ashurr managed to get the Pitt working with its steel refinery? What about Texas? Maybe Texas formed its own nation like the one from the 1830s complete with Texas Rangers (my inner Texan squeals with glee with that thought).

I dont know i think its just kinda harsh to assume that they are all gone you know. I mean yah these would be some nice replacements but here just not the ENCLAVE.

Such was the story of Europe. Such is the story of the Wasteland. Warring factions obliterate each other, and whoever is left is assimilated into the winning parties society, one way or another. The Enclave will fade into memory, except for maybe a few old fellows and their sons who still have their suit of APA.

Dont say that shdowhuntt60 your gonna make me cry(sniffle...sniffle). they cant be gone nooooooo. i guess ill just have to accept it.

Fallout 3 was the Enclave's "Plan B" and it was a poorly thoughtout and executed :facepalm: The Enclave in FO3 made little to no sense at all. Having them pop-up again as a large faction in another fallout game would just be fan service with no logic or canon behind it.

To be fair about the Enclave in FO3, it's hardly surprising that an organization descended from the government of the old country would do absolutely nothing with the capital of said country. Even if they didn't have the "all commies must die, disagree and you're a commie" overly-patriotic-attitude, and thus not have any sentimental value towards DC, it would still more than likely have good bunkers and stuff they could use, being one of the most likely targets in a nuclear war. Either way, though, the Enclave is completely, totally, and utterly f***ed as an organization. Not only did plans A and B fail, but that mobile base thing at the air base in Broken Steel, which was probably their plan C, got blasted from orbit by their own weapon

Is there some sort of 'Lore Bible' out there that makes definitive statements about what's true or not true in the Fallout Universe, or is there just what's revealed in the games themselves via the characters (with their very limited knowledge) that inhabit it? What is actually true or possible within the bounds of canon, and what the various characters of the Fallout Universe believe to be true are not necessarily the same. The only thing I would take as absolute canon in the games is what the player actually sees, not the hearsay he gets from the game's inhabitants who could very well be misinformed.

I liked the Enclave. I don't necessarily want them to show up in New Vegas, at least not as the Enclave. But an entirely new faction that rose out of the ashes of the Enclave remnants (or a renegade Brotherhood chapter, for that matter) that filled that powered armor high tech bad guy with good loot niche would be welcome in my game.

Yes, its called the :bowdown: http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Fallout_Bible


Edit: I forgot to add its not fully canon.

Ashur has the Mill running already when you go there....he has slaves cutting up cars and buses to recycle the steel....what he is manufacturing with the steel it produces we were not told. A 2nd Republic of Texas comprising some or all of the State would be a logical development, if cliched. The question is are gamesas and Obsidian interested in doing games based in Fly-Over Country locations such as the Mid-West or Texas. Years ago, when playing pen and paper RPGs, West Coast game companies in particular did not like to mention Chicago because it "competed" with places like LA and Seattle. In the old R Talsorian Cyberpunk game they actually had Chicago wiped out by a cholera plague so they wouldn't have to set a game in it.

Texas isn't really that fly-over. Plenty of oil-refineries and cities such as Dallas, Houston, and Austin. D/FW itself is pretty packed.

To people on the Coasts....especially the Left Coast...everything East of Vegas (Texas, too) is howling wilderness inhabited by Deliverance people until you get to the East Coast. When you're going with dev houses on the East and West Coast for Fallout Fly-Over Country? locations like Chicago and Texas don't have a constituency.