I don't exactly equate them with Altmer per se. Just like I don't equate Nazis with Germans (Oops...there's that word again ). I think they're another thing entirely. They're more than just the ugly (or ugliest) side of Altmer arrogance.

What you say about other hidden motivations and hangups is true enough when it comes to some persecutors, but just the way these Thalmor talk sounds like religious matters are on their mind a lot.

Auri'el, the Elven version of Akatosh, was supposed to have led them against Lorkahn, then ascended into the heavens to watch over them, more than implying he was an elven mortal turned divine.

I don't think that is exactly true. Auri'el/Akatosh created men and mer, if I remember correctly, along with Lorkahn. He can't be an elf if he helped Lorkahn create them. Gods and princes often have avatars/physical representations of themselves in the mortal world.

Speaking of Lorkhan, why the hell would Elves ever be settled about a character like that?

It's bad enough that mortals can have serious differences, but Bethesda has also written a god, Lorkhan, who participates in this stuff too. Why should Thalmor be anything than who they are?

but yes, I'm a proud Talos worshipper in all my games, no matter what faction I choose in the civil war. It is, and always will be to me, the Nine.

Worship is such a tool-ish concept.

meh. To each his own.

I'm actually not a religious man in real life. Would conflict with my Skyrim time too much.

This is true.

That's hilarious. Since I kind of am. lol

Not seriously or anything. I'm not this defiant about it though.

According to most creation myths, there was a war between Man and Mer in the Dawn Era after the creation of Mundus. Auriel sided with the Elves, whilst Lorkhan sided with Men (though Redguards don't like Lorkhan and believe Tall Papa killed him). Dunmer don't like the Eight Aedra at all and believe Lorkhan is a figure to be admired.

Man and Mer (which includes Khajiit) descend from the gods. Auriel is an ancestor in the elven tradition who lead them against Lorkhan and his Mannish allies.

For more information, read the http://www.imperial-library.info/content/monomyth.

I hope we get another elf-centric game next time. Altmer specifically need their story told better (I mean, with some conflict amongst themselves too).

If the Thalmor want Talos gone so badly, why don't they just perform the Black Sacrament and have me do it? I killed an Emperor already, I'm willing to take down a god. Mind you, it won't be cheap...

Well, there's a slight possibility that you'd have to slit your own wrists, if you accepted a contract to kill Talos.

Just throwing this out there to chew on...
The chance of Talos being a false god is a definite possibility in this world. Look at the Tribunal. Granted, I don't know if the whole reason for the fall of ALMSIVI is common knowledge (in fact, I high doubt it) but it still lends itself to the possibility of a false god.
On that note, however, I still think Talos IS a god. I met him at the Ghostgate and his power was needed to defeat Umaril. Yeah. God.

This is a long answer on the why the Thalmor hate mankind. It's in 3 parts, so if you're already familiar with TES lore then skip it. Otherwise, based on TES lore, here are reasons why the Thalmor (http://uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Thalmor) and subsequent Aldmeri Dominion (http://uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Aldmeri_Dominion) and is so obsessed with erasing Talos and all mankind from Nirn's history:

Root cause Thalmor heartburn problem #1:

You, the present modern day Dovahkin (http://uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Dovahkiin) and Talos (http://uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Tiber_Septim), are mere humans. Yet you both share a unique heritage---Akatosh's divine blessing flows through your veins. You belong to a select few mortals who were born with dragon souls. This phenomenon resulted from an ancient blessing the immortal God Akatosh granted a human slave woman called Alessia (http://uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Alessia), some 200 years before Oblivion. Alessia was a descendant of the Nedic people who settled in Cyrodil and became enslaved by the Elven Ayleids. With Akatosh's blessing as the first human Dragonborn, Alessia successfully led the human slave revolt in Cyrodil; finally freeing the enslaved humans from their Ayelid Mer masters. As Queen of the 1st Cyrodillic Empire, Alessia forged unity between the Aldmeri and humans by creating the religion of the 8 divines. According to TES lore, Queen Alessia created this religeon because:

So St. Alessia unwittingly set in motion events that would blow up some 300 years later in present day Skyrim.

Root cause Thalmor heartburn problem #2

Talos was the first Dragonborn emperor of Tamriel. As a brilliant battlefield commander, Talos's near supernatural feats of leadership and accomplishments were what led him to be revered as a leader when alive---and worshipped by mankind (especially by the Nords) as a deity after his death. While alive, Talos was the living embodiment of a demi God--none of the Aldmeri dared quarrel with him, because none could beat him on the battlefield. So if there was any resentment on the Aldmeri's part--as most certainly was the case---they suffered it in silence. With his death, Talos became the embodiment of mankind's independent spirit in Tamriel. His subsequent canonization grew into to the schism existing between the Aldmeri and men in present day Skyrim.

While Talos IS a divinity, he was NEVER a true immortal--because of his humble origins as a mortal man. More specifically, Talos was NEVER one of the immortal progeny of Anu (the force of order, life, creation and stasis) and Padomay aka Sithis (the anti-thesis force of chaos, death, destruction, and change). These two fundamental deities were the original immortals who existed before the creation of time or the TES universe (aka Mundus) of which Tamriel (on the planet Nirn) is a part.

Anu and Sithis conceived numerous immortal progeny. So by default, their immortal offspring have existed since the beginning of time---eons before the mortal Talos was ever conceived in Atmora. These immortal progeny were called et'Ada or Original Spirits. The "positive" et'Ada were most like in nature to Anu, who represented the light--so they aligned with Anu. Similarly, the "negative" et'Ada were aligned with their father Sithis, who represented the void.

Mankind across Tamriel has historically referred to these two et'Ada groups as Gods and Demons. But the Mer have always referred to them as Aedra and Daedra, which in Aldmeri means "Our Ancestors". When the et' Ada were created, two of the oldest and most notable were Lorkhan and Akatosh.

According to the lore book called "The Monomyth" (http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:The_Monomyth):

So Akatosh is the eldest of the et'Ada, and his creation was what allowed his other et'Ada siblings to form a sense of consciousness and materialize. One of his most notable siblings was Lorkhan, whose Sithis/Anu alignment is still debatable depending on the Man or Mer perspective. Lorkhan was responsible for convincing (man's view)---or "tricking"(Aldmeri view)---some of his et' Ada siblings into sacrificing significant portions of their immortality to create Mundus. This is the TES equivalent of our Milky way galaxy and universe, of which the planet Nirn is a part. Nirn predominantly consists of the Tamriel continent.

This... no use in Thalmor [censored]/girls arguing that he isn't.. its a waste of your REAL time..


Talo's Guide All you, Man, Beast-Man and Mer alike and Hail Sithis

Biggest Root cause Thalmor heartburn problem #3: Where in Oblivion was Talos when the 8 strongest et'Ada were creating the universe???

The et'Ada who Lorkhan convinced into sacrificing parts of themselves to form Mundus, became known as Aedra (http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Aedra). The et'Ada who scoffed at Lorkhan's attempted skullduggery, became known as Daedra (http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Daedra). Unlike the Daedra, many Aedra lost their immortal powers by sacrificing much of themselves into creating Nirn and Mundus.

Eight Aedra in particular, made a complete sacrifice in creating eight planets. These Aedra were canonized by St. Alessia as the 8 Divines and are still worshipped by both Man and Mer alike across present day Tamriel. Unlike their Daedric sibilings whose power is completely intact, the power of these 8 Aedra is a shadow of its former self. What's left of their power is evident through temple and shrine blessings across Tamriel.

According to TES lore and mysticism, the Aldmeri coalition (led by the Thalmor) believe they are direct descendants of Aedra who were too weak to follow the stronger Aedra like Magnus back to Aetherius (the immortal world) http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Aetherius.

These weaker Aedra became trapped on Mudus and either wasted away; became Earthbones, (eg forming the basic substances that have supported life on Nirn since its creation like water, air, soil etc); or ended up degenerating into mortal beings because of Lorkhan's "trickery". The Aldmeri believe they are the descendants of these degenerate, once immortal beings.
According to "The Monomyth", mankind believed it was created by the Aedra from Earthbones. So from the human perspective, Lorkhan's actions were highly conscientious as it allowed the creation of humans in Nirn.

Regardless of which point of view is correct, Lorkhan's actions all but destroyed the et' Ada known as Aedra, because many of them completely sacrificed their immortal selves to create the planets which makeup Mundus (http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Mundus).
After the Mundus creation, the weakened Aedra became angry with Lorkhan and punished him for his treachery. Trinimac (soon to be Malacath) ripped out Lorkan's heart and fired it into Nirn's ocean, creating the Red Mountain in Morrowind. Lorkhan's corpse remained floating above Nirn and became Tamriel's 2 moons. So Lorkhan is literally at the heart of the Aldmeri/Man racial division in Tamriel.

So those are the key reasons behind the Thalmor Dominion heartburn. From the Aldmeri perspective, the very presence of the man-God Talos being equal to the 8 Divines--given his humble origins as a mere flesh and blood mortal--is tantamount to blasphemy. In agreeing to ban Talos worship, the Empire has basically denied the possibility that mankind could achieve immortality and transcend like the et'Ada. And in doing so, the Imperials foolishly triggered the civil war in Skyrim. TES history has a nasty way of repeating itself. If the Empire wins, the Aldmeri will execute their campaign to deny mankind's right to existence in the TES universe. They will attempt to reverse the very flow of time itself and regain their lost immortality---very similar to what their Dwemer cousins attempted to do in Morrowind....

Some of you have an overblown view of Talos. He wasn't exactly dominating left and right. Like Alessia before him, he made concessions with elves (unlike Wulfarth, who wanted to smash them all. Which, by the way, also pissed Wulfarth off, that Talos was hestitant to start battles on that basis). He didn't deal with anyone like the Thalmor, but he was hesitant of batttle with the tribunal, for example. He fought them, but just like the Empire in this game, he made concessions and acknowledged much of their beliefs. This was betrayal in Wulfarth's eyes.

It's ironic that people get all stormcloak-y and militant in Talos' name, when he was not even close to acting like that himself.

Very true. But in death, the legend has overcome whatever shortcommings and failings the man possessed in life. For example, TES humans--particularly Skyrim Nords--speaking ill of Talos, is equivalent to modern day Catholics speaking ill of Pope John Paul II.

Fair enough.

I've always liked the Sinead O'Connor type of fringe Catholics myself.

well i respect talo's because of how he ascended to divine from starting off as flesh and blood.

I guess that's cool, but it doesn't even seem like his ascension had anything to do with his sense of character or badassery. It seems like an accident. A big fluke, the result of a screwup. Like one of those superhero stories. And now everyone has to just deal with it. Even the rest of the divines.

eh, my khajiit just want's to take his place lol

That's cool. I would support any khajiit getting a fair shot, for once.