[jenny goodwin]

Have you done the bards college? as I'm pretty sure you'll get a broken quests 100% of the time atleast on the PC. I've gotten to the point that I stopped goign out to explore dungeons because if I go to a quest related on without gettign the quest it usually breaks the assosiated quest. I have atleast 8 quests in my journel that are broken and about 6-8 items marks for quests and am unable to drop due to said broken quests or broken scripts that don't take away said items after it's done.

[djimi]

Have you done the bards college? as I'm pretty sure you'll get a broken quests 100% of the time atleast on the PC. I've gotten to the point that I stopped goign out to explore dungeons because if I go to a quest related on without gettign the quest it usually breaks the assosiated quest. I have atleast 8 quests in my journel that are broken and about 6-8 items marks for quests and am unable to drop due to said broken quests or broken scripts that don't take away said items after it's done.

Yep i finished the bards college quests, the itmes werent removed but they are weightless so it really affects nothing.

[ILy- Forver]

https://unofficialskyrimpatch.16bugs.com/projects/7078 http://baldurdash.org/TESOblivion/UOPFixList.html /sarcasm

If you aren't running into any bugs, you aren't playing the game right.

Your quest journal is a list of things you can do, not a list of things you have to do.

Todd Howard (over)emphasized freedom of choice in Skyrim. Why is it we can't choose to remove quests from our journal? Seems a bit odd. No, it's not a list of things we have to do, but it's still a list of incomplete quests that will never, ever, ever go away unless we complete them (if we're capable of completing them (sans any technical issues (sans any role-playing issues))).

Yup. Open world, alright.

[jessica breen]

https://unofficialskyrimpatch.16bugs.com/projects/7078 http://baldurdash.org/TESOblivion/UOPFixList.html /sarcasm

If you aren't running into any bugs, you aren't playing the game right.


Todd Howard (over)emphasized freedom of choice in Skyrim. Why is it we can't choose to remove quests from our journal? Seems a bit odd. No, it's not a list of things we have to do, but it's still a list of incomplete quests that will never, ever, ever go away unless we complete them (if we're capable of completing them (sans any technical issues (sans any role-playing issues))).

Yup. Open world, alright.

I have several bugs, like I said before none of them have been big though.

[chinadoll]

I only dream on one thing:
Be able to delete/remove an unwanted quest so I don't have to get in a bad mood every time I look in my questbook and see it there.

[Jessica Nash]

If you didnt want it you shoudlnt have picked it up.

[Everardo Montano]

If you didnt want it you shoudlnt have picked it up.

You do know that a lot of quests are pushed on you, right? You aren't asked if you'd like to start most quests. They just start for you, and your only two options are to complete the quest or ignore it. And if you can't complete it for whatever reason, you're stuck with it.

[Niisha]

You do know that a lot of quests are pushed on you, right? You aren't asked if you'd like to start most quests. They just start for you, and your only two options are to complete the quest or ignore it. And if you can't complete it for whatever reason, you're stuck with it.

<--- has done every quest in the game and did not have one that could not be avoided by eiather not talking to a persoon or not going to that specific dungeon.

[Lizbeth Ruiz]

<--- has done every quest in the game and did not have one that could not be avoided by eiather not talking to a persoon or not going to that specific dungeon.

But that requires you to know beforehand what initiates quests.

I've avoided Molag Bal's quest with this character by not offering help to the Vigilant. However he asks me the same question everytime i go past him. I guess they really want me to play that quest

[SiLa]

But that requires you to know beforehand what initiates quests.

I've avoided Molag Bal's quest with this character by not offering help to the Vigilant. However he asks me the same question everytime i go past him. I guess they really want me to play that quest

thats why my firs playthrough of a game is awlays a "check to see where is where and what to avouid" playtrhough.


Did it on both morrowind and Oblivion.

[Philip Lyon]

I was wondering, did Oblivion, no wait, ANY game have the option of allowing you to remove quests?

[Isabella X]

As I said in the title, the railroading in this game has just been awful. I love the game overall, please don't misunderstand-but I have been cornered into doing many things I have not wanted to.

I can't tell you how many evil Daedric princes I now serve because I wasn't warned about what quests I was about to go do, or don't have the option to kill them.

Same here. I wanted to foil their plots, not help them, except for Meridia

[BlackaneseB]

Its not rail roading unless your forced to COMPLETE the quest. The quest showing up in your journal is not railroading no matter how much you whine about it. Its just annoying to people with a OCD about having everything in there listed as complete.Many daedric quests offer me a chance to say FU to the daedra. It doesn't always work out as sometimes they find your "betrayl" fun. Such as with Hircine. And in other cases your fighting against another data. To get the Molag Bal your required to kill the worshiper of another evil daedra Boethiah.

So name three quests that railroad you, keep in mind anything you can avoid ahead of time without prior knowledge OR you can refuse to finish does not count.

[Stu Clarke]

Wow.

So, my son just picked up this game for his console. Not his mother's Elder Scrolls, lol.

Anyway, just wanted to say that although my son likes his Call of Duty and other shooter games, it doesn't mean he didn't fall in love with Morrowind/Oblivion (as did I) back in the day. He still misses Jib and Caius.

Near as I can tell, and I haven't played it all that much, Skyrim does appear to be a bit more "guided." There is definitely physical freedom in terms of going where you want in the environment. I think new expansions just take a bit of getting used to when they take a sharper deviation from the franchise than we're used to. Most things evolve, storylines, relationships, games, the next expansion may be more to your liking than this one, and the modders always refine games more to the gamers' tastes. It just takes a little time. Put it away if you can't stand it right now and wait for the modders to do their thing.

(and Beth? how about taking some of the best user mods and packaging them for dlc on consoles?)

On a side note, why all the hate for people who want to play good guys? If you want to be an evil, demonic, thieving sot, then you go boy! or girl! Personally, I'm an evil person in real life, I just use rpg's to explore my inner desires to be a good person. To each their own.

[Claire Jackson]

Bethesda could legally take the mods and put them as DLC but Micro[censored] and Sony would flp a gasket.


Xbox Live and the PSN are terribly restrictive in what they allow.

[candice keenan]

Bethesda could legally take the mods and put them as DLC but Micro[censored] and Sony would flp a gasket.


Xbox Live and the PSN are terribly restrictive in what they allow.

No they wouldn't. If Bethesda wanted to take a mod and turn it into a DLC, then they would have to test it and iron out any bug they found themselves.

Microsoft and Sony have an issue with user made content being freely used on their system, not just user content in general. Because it would have to go though the channels of a developer, they would be fine with it because they can pin any problems on that developer if any arise. People freely adding mods at will without any oversight is their issue.

[maddison]

No they wouldn't. If Bethesda wanted to take a mod and turn it into a DLC, then they would have to test it and iron out any bug they found themselves.

I never said they wouldn't? radom nd unrealted to anything I typed.

Microsoft and Sony have an issue with user made content being freely used on their system, not just user content in general.

I know thats why I said it

[kirsty williams]

*sigh*

leave

them

open

It seems like such a simple answer to such a heated topic. Above are subjects A-F at least, most of them a lot of QQ about missed expectations and frustrations that things are not precisely as one person or another wanted them.

On the main point of this thread, yes... some of this stuff is driven and almost unavoidable... and as was said more than once by more than just myself... the quest in your log is given whether you wanted it or not and you don't ever have to complete it.

I can go halfway across the country and do something else for 15 levels before returning and thinking "oh noes! I forgot the kitteh in the box!" only to find out the cat in the box is fine and still waiting for me to rescue it. (to my knowledge there is no such quest, this is only an example)

I have some quests I never did and other's I've reloaded my game and avoided having full stop because I refuse to do them and didn't know I was in the dialogue that would begin them.

All this ugly from just a couple posters is a reflection of the people talking, I'd have to say. They're not representative of the whole and really seem to exist in every forum and game in the world.

Dude... It's a game and you're not as powerless as you think. If you're really this unhappy with it I have to agree with our friend above who suggested you focus your efforts by talking to the designers with your wallet and spend less energy here in the forums where the logical answer would be that we have just as much or as little power as you perceive yourself to have.

Has anyone else played some of the MMO's most famous for railroading and streamlining before?

If you have then I don't even have to hint at why I'm so pleased to have found such a lovely and dynamic world, because at least I had a choice to hit up Morthal or become Thane of Markarth and if I need a friend to help me I don't have to wait for Lydia to get the kids to bed or Faendahl to get his homework done before we can go clear a dungeon.

And if I wanna hit the end of the MQ on a mage in her starter robes with no perks spent yet because I wanna know if I can, I don't get called a phail and left out of the group for being undergeared. lol

(oh, the answer is up to middle difficulty the perks are unnecessary on that character for me. middle difficulty cost me just about all my potions and a whole lot of invisibility potions and I died a real lot. From there up in difficulty I was miserably incapable of getting my poor little mage even up to the door of Skuldafn without spending her perks and still needed the potions. The draugr ate her even when she popped invisibility potions and booked bootie up and into the dungeon using fast heal.)

Woot... now I'm on subject G or H! ha

[Dj Matty P]

"No good deed goes unpunished"

Seems to be a mantra of this game.

Play something else if you wanna be Dudley Do-Right and come through squeaky clean.

I understand the plight of those who wish to be "paladins" or what-not, but seriously, I think the lack of black-and-white absolutism is a good thing.

Luring do-gooders into taintful predicaments is a good thing. Why wouldn't Evil try to corrupt you, and put permanent stains upon your lily white smock, if nothing else?

Should a "Paladin" slay Paarthurnax?

I think this game presents some genuinely challenging dilemmas. Who cares if your sense of "completionism" or other OCD issue makes you flip out over not being able to blank out all items from your quest log.

Think of them as whispers in the back of your mind... I know y'all mostly try to be good people throughout your life, but... just about everybody has fantasized about killing somebody, at some point, even if it was just a flash in a moment of fury.

The game gleefully indulges/explores the darker sides of human nature. Without much sugar-coat. But yet, people call it shallow.

Well said! I think corruption and greed is just part of the human nature. Most of use just chose not to indulge in the darker things of life. So, my third character is all about shadows and darkness. She follows the Night Mother and she's part of the Thieves guild. She has no qualms about killing someone, stealing something and cares less about what's in her log or the civil war lol

Now and then, she does help others, if there's a profit to be made... hahaha

During my first play through, I did everything, followed every quest, became head of every guild etc (no I did NOT and will NEVER kill Paarthurnax! lol) Some quests could not be completed, because I didn't know about all those glitches (Bard college for example. If you pick up Finn's Lute for example, before you get the quest, you can't complete it and it will be stuck in your inventory and log forever... same with the other 2 instrument quests from the Bards college). Initially I was bothered by it, but then I knew what to avoid in my next play through.

Now, I just complete what I can and ignore the rest (like I don't think I'll join either war faction with this toon).

@ Julienne LOLOL Yea, I wouldn't take YOUR mage on any raid! psh

[john page]

leave

them

open

It seems like such a simple answer to such a heated topic.

It's not as simple as you make it out to be. Ignoring it does not make it go away. Why would a good-aligned character even have a "Go help Molag Bal" quest in their log? Why should such a good-aligned character not try to do everything possible to bring closure to it? This in addition to being a usability nightmare, cluttering the quest log with tasks you're completely uninterested in completing and cluttering your inventory with quest items you can't drop.

The game railroads you because it makes you finish a quest in a specific way, even if you've been actively trying to sabotage it. Tell Molag Bal to f-off, tell the Priest of Boethia what Bal was planning, go and make sure he doesn't get himself killed... oh, you want to see the priest dead, right? okay, now go do what you've been actively working against.

How is that not railroading? It ignores the entire reason you did what you did, forcing you to a specific end despite doing everything possible to turn away from that end. It completely lacks giving you the option to do what your character would do.


Another example is Jaree-Ra, in Solitude. He offers you a not-so-legal job. Your choices are to say yes, or threaten to turn him over to the guards. If you threaten him, he just brushes it off and you're not able to actually tell the guards, while he waits for you to change your mind. Again, railroading as the only way you can finish the quest is by doing it a specific way, and not being given reasonable options that your character would do.


The kicker is that some of these quests are already failable, such as the Molag Bal quest. However, to fail it you have to resort to murder, which instantly locks out the option for any good-aligned characters. So you have a quest where the only way to fail it is to be a murderer, and trying to do the "right thing" locks you into becoming a murderer. There's no reason a good-aligned character couldn't also fail the quest by refusing Bal's command.

Skyrim: where no means yes.

[AnDres MeZa]

It's not as simple as you make it out to be. Ignoring it does not make it go away. Why would a good-aligned character even have a "Go help Molag Bal" quest in their log?

Skyrim: where no means yes.

omg

lmao.

I am quite possibly the most anol, obsessive and completely fruity player I've ever known. I said in my first post that my boyfriend had to work really hard to break me of my compulsive Monk-ish need to clear my log. I've learned to reload JUST SO I DON'T HAVE TOO MANY THAT I KNOW I WONT EVER DO.

The complaint here is that you're railroaded into doing quests.

The answer is that you're not.

Don't do them if you don't want to. Answering that with an example of a log full of quests sort of goes back to a place where you might possibly be more compulsive and obsessive than I am and I am actively worried about that. lmao

A good character would still face situations along the way that challenged them to find a clever way to stay good. The game is written well enough that sometimes you don't realize something is ugly until you're already too deeply in to walk away. Head out the door and don't look back.

Jeebus... don't go to Markarth and whatever you do DO NOT GO INTO THE CRYPTS IN MARKARTH TO FIND OUT WHAT'S GOING ON WITH THE DEAD DOWN THERE... you'll murder your character before it occurs to you to reload from the door and turn around!

[casey macmillan]

This is why people should make a playthrough BEFORE they make a role-play charicter... It'll be like trying to do a speed run the first time you buy a game. You're going to make alot of mistakes and miss alot of things you might otherwise do.

And as some have mentioned, the way they do it is clever. It adds another layer to the game. I don't want to know someone is evil just by looking at them, I want to be suprised, not bored with how I could see every little detail coming.

[Julie Serebrekoff]

I am quite possibly the most anol, obsessive and completely fruity player I've ever known. I said in my first post that my boyfriend had to work really hard to break me of my compulsive Monk-ish need to clear my log. I've learned to reload JUST SO I DON'T HAVE TOO MANY THAT I KNOW I WONT EVER DO.

Good for you. Not everyone likes to meta-game like that, unfortunately. Meta-gaming is the anti-thesis of role-playing, and this is a role-playing game.

Many people, including myself, like to play with consequences. That means not reloading unless you die or something extraordinarily bad happens that makes the game unplayable. It's not a problem if something bad happens (eg, the Priest gets killed despite you trying to prevent it), but it is a problem when the game forces you out of character (eg, it makes you to kill him to finish the quest).

It completely ruins the fun if I have to worry about whether a quest getting dumped on me is something I won't be able to complete "properly", thus either be stuck with it, or reload and forever keep in mind to stay clear away from that quest trigger. It pulls me out of the game, and I'd end up fighting against it more than actually playing with it.

[ruCkii]

Bethesda needs to be held responsible. Car companies cannot sell incomplete cars. Toy makers cannot sell incomplete toys. Why should Bethesda be able to sell incomplete games? And what's worse is that they don't even bother to fix them before moving on. How many bugs do you think Fallout 3 still has? How about Oblivion? Oh, and don't even get me started on Morrowind. It's [censored], plain and simple, and the fact that people are perfectly content with it is disgusting; like a complacent flock of sheep.

There is a difference between molded products that can be quickly inspected by some 18yr old kid and easily measured by QA tools versus a product that involves thousands of lines of code, which involves several application creating softwares all used together to make a finished product. A huge difference, CK assists with this - allowing players to configure the game more appropriately.

[IsAiah AkA figgy]

The point is that you're not forced to complete the quest.

It is an opportunity that has been offered to your character, and in the game like in real life lots of things come up that you do or do not want anything to do with. You cannot undo them being there. They are not a requirement that has to be finished like some checklist from the gods.

No one is making you do anything.

Wanting the ability to abandon quests at the cost of a real lot of programming that gums up the working of the game or a ! over the head of quest givers to warn you that something might be afoot is no less frustrating for some of us than the untaken opportunity in the quest log seems to be for you.

I outed myself as a fruit because I do compulsively close the quests in my log. I should have said also that I have a character that collects quests as a badge of proof what she has NOT done, things she has seen and chose not to participate in versus all of the things she has done.

I offered the example of a reload as a last-ditch effort.

y'all are on your own. it's very clear that the gimping and "rule making" each of us practices in the leveling of our characters in this game superceeds logic or rational thought.