Where exactly did I say that? What gives you the right to make such an assumption?

I will reserve judgement on the almost all major bugs fixed until 1.6 releases and I can see if the respawn bug has actually fixed the enemy respawns. Also my plants never respawn in locations dotted around the map.

Then Bethesda has still not fixed ash piles properly some still never clean up.

There is also the issue when you kill enemies they drop their weapons and leave their weapons and shields laying around everywhere and they never clean up. Then after a while they begin to float in air.

This game still needs a lot more bug fixes.

According to the person (one of them anyway) who brought that bug to their attention, its still there.

I don't understand your post. At all.

The time Bethesda has? So wait, it's ok for Bethesda not to have time to fix bugs whereas it's not ok for Obsidian not to have time to fix bugs?

What does it matter if only one serious issue is related to Oblivion? Skyrim and FO3 aren't Bethesda products now? Furthermore, no, there's several, but excuse me for not listing EVERY bug. The Unofficial Oblivion patch fixes 2,200 bugs. Go read through it yourself and you'll find plenty.

So you think Molag Bal's mace not working as it should, level lists for unique items and artifacts working incorrectly (i.e., you're level 26 and you get the level 4 version of the artifact), the Necromancer's amulet disappearing from the game and various quest bugs are "not important." You think perks like Solar Powered and Nerves of Steel in FO3 barely functioning at all due to a misplaced decimal and NEVER being patched is perfectly fine? As if to say "LOL JUST KIDDING those perks basically aren't in the game they're so broken." Even so, even if we were to agree all of those are not important, I still would like to know why Bethesda's bugs are "not important" but Obsidian's are. Both have featured bugs that break quests, both have featured bugs that make items fail to work properly; you name a type of glitch, both Obsidian and Bethesda are guilty of it. I'm not claiming Obsidian's games are bug free, but I DO see a severe case of the pot calling the kettle black here on these forums, and I find it odd people think "bugs" is truly an issue that seperates Obsidian and Bethesda. Maybe other developers could insult Obsidian and say they could create a less-buggy experience, but BETHESDA? I mean get real...


Skyrim, go check the skill bugs. We still have perks that simply don't work at all. Go check the quest Blood on the Ice. As for the navmesh bug, can't say I know much about it.

Bethesda improved their engine to the point where it looks Like a whole new one, and the development time was 3 years. And if we compare Fallout 3 to Fallout New Vegas, Bethesda had 2 years to update their engine, and add content, while all Obsidian had to do was add content. If Bethesda took more time with Fallout 3 (like the 4 years they took with Oblivion), it would have as much content as New Vegas, all of it with meaningful back stories. Again, the only things Obsidian does better is Factions and Characters. Have you ever tried walking in FNV? It's just boring as hell. Bethesda made a freakin wasteland an awesome place to walk in.

AHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHA

Where are the spears? All those other features we asked for?


(edit: on kvatch vs winterhold- Kvatch had an important part of the main story and was actualy MADE. Winterhold just had some houses by a cliff with tales of it falling into the sea. There isn't even any wreckage at the bottom. it's layness)

Like horse combat? Gee, I wonder where that is... Or like more useful vamps and werewolves? Yeah that's definitely not happening...

Damn you Bethesda!!!

Seriously what do you expect? Bethesda to enter everything we want into the game, that will never fit...

it would. If they had spent less time hiring big name voice actors for npcs like nazeem with only two lines of dialogue and actualy removed all their inept members and replaced them with ones that knew what they were doing then we would be fine. Plus all those stupid tiny quests like "fetch this"

Bethesda are only adding things like crossbows and better werewolves because they fit with the cliche monster movie plot of dawnguard. Not because we asked for them but because a van helsing dovakhin would sell well.

So wait, if they do things we all want it's because it would sell well and their basically still a bunch of asses, and if they don't it because they're a bunch of asses?

By that logic they can't do anything right. Horse combat was still added for free by the way, they could have charged for that and millions would likely have paid for it as well.

Also do you honestly believe that something like crossbows is going to be the selling point for Dawnguard, do you think people would have been less excited if it didn't have crossbows?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H4_9kDO3q0w

I wonder if the Pythons realise the impact they had on peoples heads....

Bethesda is only excells at art. Best concept artists in the industry in my opinion but I don't see how spending most of their time working on repetetive dungeons is such a good thing. With the amount of time they worked on Skyrim I expected good graphics, yes, and we got that, but I also expected at least a little better story, characters or at the very least a skill system that improves on the one in Oblivion.
I don't see the point in exploring Skyrim, I don't see the point of all these dungeons the majority of which is draugr tombs. All you can get from it is gold you don't need, equipment you don't need and levels and skills that make exploring easier than it already is. Oh and there's a few collectibles like . . . insects in jars.

And yet a huge problem with Oblivion was that you leveling didn't provide any purpose at all. All enemies were leveled, and even running around the imperial city in circles would provide me with the most powerful weapons and armor the game had to offer. Besides what you just mentioned as weaknesses has been in the game since Daggerfell it's what makes TES, TES.

Facepalm

bethesda would make what sells well. To appease the masses they sacrifice stuff that the more elder tes fans love ( decent story in favour of omgwtf dwagons , volkihar for generic user friendly vampires. werewolves as a voluntary thing, falmer for goblins etc)

obsidian would work on finding ways that makes all types of fans happy.

Werewolves weren't added in Morrowind until Bloodmoon, but somehow that's okay? Yet you are now already talking about vamps svcking when the vamp DLC hasn't even been released yet... How about you wait for that first..
I agree with the Lore that has weakened a lot, but to somehow believe Obsidian who has not invented a single thing of it and who definitely wouldn't know it as well as Bethesda do would improve the matters is just crazy.

Dragons have always been a part of the TES universe by the way, this isn't even the first game you can find them. Obsidian would have likely just named the Falmer goblins and wouldn't have explained anything about them, other then your stereotypical Goblin talk. The falmer maybe weak but at least they provide new lore.

I get it, your not happy with Skyrim, but you could try to be realistic about it.

In other words, 'it's popular, so now it svcks'.

I honestly really enjoyed the Skyrim storylines (with the possible exception of the CoW ...) and think that they are 'decent stories'.

Read the last thread again, I didn't make the claim. All I did was provide facts. Someone else made the claim.


Barber in Dawnguard? o.O
Mounted combat is comng with 1.6, not Dawnguard.


I find some elements of FO3's gameworld more belivable than NV, but hey that's my opinion. Now tell me I'm wrong.

Their 100% Original Stuff includes their story and characters which blew me away in New Vegas and especially the DLC. Also the skills/stats/weapons were way more balanced than F3. So you shut your mouth you!


You're wrong.

Fallout 3: Square mile of dirt with some hobo's and brahmin. Towns with just a few people and no water/food supply survive amongst super mutant and enclave armies. And deathclaws. And more radiation than there could be after 200 years. And stores full of 200 year old water/food that's perfectly edible.

New Vegas: Many factions, cities, water/food supplies, people, camps etc.

My OPINION is no more wrong than yours

A couple things....
Maybe I've misunderstood the definition, but can an engine look new? The graphics engine can, obviously, but when they just say "engine" without specifying which, I assume they mean a total revamp of all the coding and programming.
....Which they didn't do. Gamebryo was criticized to no end, and yet it's still here. Oh I know, it got a name change to "Creation engine" because apparently this actually manages to fool 90% of the public, but the game still has the same coding, the same glitches, the same overall feel. That's still Gamebryo, and I somehow doubt that took them 3 years. Or if they did spent 3 years fine-tuning a graphics engine alone, then I would say that's a waste of time, after a certain point.


I actually think Oblivion is the closest Bethesda has come to correct RPG leveling.
What did Oblivion do wrong?

1) Leveled spawns. Not every enemy leveled, only a handful did. The problem was the spawns leveled to the point where they were 95% likely to spawn one of those leveled creatures. If they had just provided the game with fixed spawns, where certain creatures spawn at certain points, then it wouldn't be an issue. You don't mind that ogre that can kick your butt even when you're level 40 as long as you only meet him once and a while, but when he's on every road it's a nuisance.

2) Leveled enemy gear. Obviously this meant glass armor grew on trees.

If they fixed those two things, I think it would actually be a superior system to both FO3 and Skyrim, which have the (imo) mistake of including enemies that ALWAYS pierce through a certain amount of your defenses.



Let's get real here: what established lore about Skyrim actually ended up mattering?
Here I'll help you: the Thu'um.

THAT'S IT.
Small details like Nords saying Talos instead of Tiber Septim or cities such as Riften made it, but a lot of other basics didn't.

Werebears? Not included.
Volkihar vampires? Completely rewritten into a cliché idea
Falmer? Completely redone into a cliché mob type
Winterhold as a major city? Blown up
Alduin and Akatosh are one in the same? Not anymore.

And this is just Nord-based content. Even the Argonians and Redguard got some retcons in Skyrim.


Let's get real here: Bethesda doesn't exactly handle their lore with utmost care.

Obsidian? Are you aware the project director of Obsidian both took a personal biking trip through the Mojave to Las Vegas AND took up firearms, for the sake of providing New Vegas with real-life locations (many of the locations you'll find in New Vegas such as Goodsprings and Helios ONE actually DO have real life counterparts) and realistic balance among the firearms and realistic firearm mechanics. This is a company that does it's [censored] homework. I mean hell, they kind of have to since people typically hire them to handle an existing series. I think TES would be in good hands, to be perfectly honest.

And to be perfectly honest, I do NOT think Bethesda takes TES seriously enough so that ANY third party developer could commit an atrosity. Bethesda already retcons their own series on a regular basis, what difference does it make if someone else does the retconning? I mean seriously....


Played New Vegas?
"Decent" to define TES storylines is generally the case (though Skyrim's Thieves' guild is just one giant plot hole), but when you compare "decent" to "excellent," then suddenly decent doesn't seem so great. In the same why, I'd say Oblivion's graphics are still quite decent even today, but some people no longer think decent is good enough.
Decent seems like the bare minimum to make the story appealing enough to keep playing, and tbh even Skyrim's storylines achieving "decent" status is debateable.



-How does Tenpenny Tower make any sense? How did these people generate wealth in a world that's fighting for survival and what on earth does Tenpenny gain from charging them? Tenpenny Tower would only make sense as a communist nation, where everyone pools together their wealth and works together to provide the tower with luxurious accomidations so they can all live comfortably until death. None of them are working so their wealth is finite, and the Tower implies that if you don't pay rent, you get kicked out. This is redundant and ridiculous however as all Tenpenny is doing is taking money from the people and using it to buy food and water. They ALL need food and water and whether they pay Tenpenny first or not, you can be sure he'll end up using their money to buy food to feed them with ANYWAYS. His demand of rent only earns him an extra title of power that allows him to manipulate the entire tower to his own benefit, ripping off all the citizens. Knowing that literally EVERYONE (the shopkeepers, the citizens, the guards) would benefit from not having to worry about paying him rent, it makes absolutely zero sense that they haven't overthrown him.

The ultimate need in the post-apocalyptic wastes is food and water. How can you generate wealth in such a scenario? You'd want all the food and water you can get, and if you DID produce wealth in such a setting, it would imply you sold food and water to people, which doesn't fit in with the situation of the CW, where both are rare.

The people pay Tenpenny rent they can stay with him. They also pay money for food and clothing there. Tenpenny presumably uses the rent money to buy.....well, food and water, which he then sells to the people. Or the merchants buy the food and water and tenpenny is just pocketing the money, doing jack with it since he can't possibly need THAT much food or water himself. Or he's wasting it on ammo.

No matter what way you look at it, he's a leech on the community. Sure, he built the damn thing, but now he's bringing the entire community down. Why the HELL isn't anyone killing him and declaring Tenpenny Tower a communist nation that works together to provide everyone with luxurious lives until death?

-Megaton: why? Megaton formed around the bomb because it provided cover from the dust storms. However it wasn't enough. They needed barriers to truly stop the dust storms AND to protect them from raiders. Megaton's oldest citizen will tell you that the people of Megaton completely dismantled the remains of an airport and transported it to the undetonated atomic bomb to use to build it's walls and buildings.
Gee Megaton, it's great that you guys were motivated hard-workers and all, but you know what would've been easier? Moving to Rivet City.

-Little Lamplight. 'Nuff said.

-Any civilization not visited by the trade caravans. Let's get one thing straight: the traders of FO3 are the true heroes. They're the ONLY ones actually getting off their asses and doing work that makes a difference. If the trade caravans were to leave the Capital Wasteland? Everyone would sit at home with their thumbs up their asses and starve to death like the idiots they are. They depend on the caravans for food, they often depend on the caravans for water and they defend on the caravans for defense. NO ONE in the wasteland is producing ANYTHING, so everything's a finite resource. And who's the only one making sure these finite resources are reaching people? The trade caravans.
Having said that, how the hell is Girdershade still alive, or the Republic of Dave....

I heavily disagree here, I much prefered the system in Morrowind. But this is a really personal opinion. I want to feel difference between low and high levels, I want to find dungeons that I can't beat and that I later can and perhaps even dungeons that are incredibly easy because I'm just that powerful... But like I said this is personal preference, I don't really think you can ever find a large group that will agree on this.



The Thu'um is there.
The Greybeards are there.
Kynareth as the way of the voice is there.
Snow Throat as a tower of creation is there.
The entire Thalmor plot line, to destroy man is to destroy Talos is to undo creation is there.
The 500 companions of Ysgramor
The Arcturian Heressy is pretty much proven true in Skyrim

Sure it failed on a lot of levels but I don't think Obsidian would have done even one of those things, let alone stand all.

Edit: About the Falmer, I don't get these complaints. They were either underground or gone, that we knew for sure before Skyrim and gone was more likely. Now they've added an interesting history to them, a reason for them to be underground and to have turned into what they are. Sure it could have been better, but it could have been a lot worse. Like with normal goblins.

That comes down to opinion really. Morrowind and New Vegas have a different style where there are enemies you can't yet beat at some locations. I agree, I prefer that style, but most people here seem not to. If not Morrowind/New Vegas style, then what I suggested is the best alternative, imo. Let certain spawns spawn wolves exclusively when you're level one, but when you're level 40, they max out spawning black bears 40% of the time. Other areas can be the deadly areas they level all the way with you.


Because their history makes no damned sense. The dwarves wanted to help them but didn't trust them, so they compromised by....poisoning them? Poisoning them until they were blind and weak, at which point the dwarves said "this is an ideal slave labor team if I've ever seen one!"

If someone comes to your door now and says he's hungry and homeless, and you WANT to help him but you don't trust him? You apologize and tell him no, you won't help him. You don't let him into your home and proceed to overdose him on all sorts of medication. That's straight up psychotic.

The Dwemer were never supposed to be a nice race, those children stories you read about them aren't real you know... Serisously though an entire race of elves was near wiped out by humans, the dwarves let them in but of course they didn't trust them. So they used them as slaves, the best way to ensure their loyalty was to make them dependent on items only the Dwemer could provide so they did. I see nothing strange about it, it's interesting and a lot more fun then just "The Nords wiped them out"

Ok first id like to add that o believe obsidian would actually work harder following lore instead of breaking it like Bethesda does.
How many times has Bethesda broken lore in their tes games and how many times has obsidian broken lore in fo games? I believe obsidian has a much better track record.

Both obsidian and Bethesda releasss games with game breaking and system breakimg problems. Both are good at fixing ther bugs but I do havs to admit obsidian with one game fixed a majority of theirs and skyrim seema the first game that Bethesda is willing to fix themselves instead of relying on modders to fix.

Given that obsidian had only one year to make fonv and they improved on ever gameplay mechanic and even though the world didnt have the pezazz that the other game had, it was still a realist world.

I still stand by my comment that if obsidian did a tes game, it would be the next morrowind or daggerfall.


Betheada keeps changing to bring more fans in, obsidian trys to excell and satisfy their fanbase.

Difference is that Obsidian never wrote the lore in the first place... I just don't see how a change in the company that makes it could possibly create a better Lore.

Obsidian's secret ingredient is love.

And as you know in TES lore, love is key and comes in many sizes and forms.