Why Are There No Classes? : V - Skyrim

» Sat Jul 07, 2012 1:03 pm

You dont plan out anything in skyrim. Its all in a skill tree. You level on the spot with NO thinking. You use a warhammer, u level 2 handed.

But isn't that the same as oblivion? You use skills to level skills in that game as well.

» Sat Jul 07, 2012 6:19 pm

No label = no class.

Meaningless label is meaningless.

What matters is the skills you actually use. Which was never restricted by anything in MW, or Oblivion.

» Sat Jul 07, 2012 4:09 pm

But isn't that the same as oblivion? You use skills to level skills in that game as well.

God, since when was I saying, "Make everything like Oblivion." NO!! Make a system better, dont copy it from another game, and most certainly dont remove it!!

» Sat Jul 07, 2012 12:25 pm

Although, a good compromise would be having the game update what build you have on the save slot. If you put enough perks and time into magic & weapons, "Battlemage" could replace your race.

» Sat Jul 07, 2012 7:44 pm

God, since when was I saying, "Make everything like Oblivion." NO!! Make a system better, dont copy it from another game, and most certainly dont remove it!!

So you want something completely different from any elder scrolls game? Than mined explaining what you actually want?

» Sat Jul 07, 2012 7:54 pm

Meaningless label is meaningless.

What matters is the skills you actually use. Which was never restricted by anything in MW, or Oblivion.

Its not just a label, its a jumpstart on base skills that you plan to use the entire game.

» Sat Jul 07, 2012 9:44 am

Meaningless label is meaningless.

What matters is the skills you actually use. Which was never restricted by anything in MW, or Oblivion.

Once more, bullhockey.
It may not have done very much, but it was there.
I was Merari, the Avatar. (Avatar of whom, they might wonder.)
Now Im just Merari.

I dont care about any apologetics.
What is not in the game anymore is not in the game anymore.
Basta.

» Sat Jul 07, 2012 2:54 pm

...what its done is make all high level characters exactly the same.

Around the water cooler youre not swapping stories about what kind of character youve played as...youre just checking which perks each other took.

No matter how insane an internet arguement artist you are NOTHING can make that a better direction for the series.

» Sat Jul 07, 2012 1:56 pm

So you want something completely different from any elder scrolls game? Than mined explaining what you actually want?

Make the class system more developed and stop people from being the jack of all trades but dont limit them to sword and board by making you have to put most your perks into 2 skills. Also, you can use expert level destruction magic without putting perks in it just by leveling ur magicka. They should have skill level restrictions on that.

» Sat Jul 07, 2012 3:27 pm

...what its done is make all high level characters exactly the same.

Around the water cooler youre not swapping stories about what kind of character youve played as...youre just checking which perks each other took.

No matter how insane an internet arguement artist you are NOTHING can make that a better direction for the series.

Wait how are we the same. Perhaps I'm just thinking completely differently and can see where you guys are coming from? I always see people talk about builds with names attached. The perks also allow people to be diverse with in a class. Two mages can actually be different yet similar. I guess I just don't get your guys attachment to a label given by a virtual game that actually has no effect on said game.

» Sat Jul 07, 2012 1:13 pm

...what its done is make all high level characters exactly the same.

Around the water cooler youre not swapping stories about what kind of character youve played as...youre just checking which perks each other took.

No matter how insane an internet arguement artist you are NOTHING can make that a better direction for the series.

Mad Max provides excellent points. The removal of the class system instead of making improvements is a step in the wrong direction for the series. Thats a slippery slope to completely mainstreaming a game to a demented version of its former self.

» Sat Jul 07, 2012 8:53 pm

Gents, I'm surprised and at the same time amused that all of you have not only been feeding the troll, but taking this guys "arguement" seriously. I lurk and spend a lot of time in the Gamefaqs Skyrim (360) forums, so maybe I have a keen eye for trolls. For the sake of staying on topic, TC ... use your damn imagination. Your question has been answered multiple times and your "counter arguements" destroyed. It's an RPG, and it's not the game restricting you from how you want to play, you're restricting yourself.

Damn, I bit >.<

» Sat Jul 07, 2012 6:19 pm

Wait how are we the same. Perhaps I'm just thinking completely differently and can see where you guys are coming from? I always see people talk about builds with names attached. The perks also allow people to be diverse with in a class. Two mages can actually be different yet similar. I guess I just don't get your guys attachment to a label given by a virtual game that actually has no effect on said game.

Spoken like a true mainstream gamer. Classes and how they function has been the foundation of Elder Scrolls and how you played your character. Now, i find a warhammer on the ground and swing despite my original intentions on the class. The skill level has nothing to do with effectiveness besides letting you get perks. Perks are the only thing that count in this game, which is sad really. Makes it feel like im buying something rather than earning it through progression.

» Sat Jul 07, 2012 5:19 pm

Make the class system more developed and stop people from being the jack of all trades but dont limit them to sword and board by making you have to put most your perks into 2 skills. Also, you can use expert level destruction magic without putting perks in it just by leveling ur magicka. They should have skill level restrictions on that.

Hell no. Why would you want to stop people from being a Jack of all trades? That is lame as hell. Also the current system kind of does that. The perks force you to specialize, to be good at somethings, but weaker in others.

Oh, and you can use expert level spells without putting perks. Just get your skill level up. The perks just make the spell casting cost less magicka.

Spoken like a true mainstream gamer. Classes and how they function has been the foundation of Elder Scrolls and how you played your character. Now, i find a warhammer on the ground and swing despite my original intentions on the class.

OK. This is idiotic. The name means nothing. If you need some random lable to determine how to play your character then the game isnt the problem.

How lame.. You need the computer to lock you into a class for you to play that class? If you want to be a swordsman..

Here's a hint: Just use a sword,

» Sat Jul 07, 2012 4:27 pm

Make the class system more developed and stop people from being the jack of all trades but dont limit them to sword and board by making you have to put most your perks into 2 skills. Also, you can use expert level destruction magic without putting perks in it just by leveling ur magicka. They should have skill level restrictions on that.

So you just don't like jack of all trades? Never seen the problem since one it is a single player game and two they are also the master of non and suffer for it. As for destruction magic I can see where your coming from. Would indeed make sense to have a check for skill level. I do think that it is harder to acquire the skills if your low level since merchants don't sell them however, but the skill check would still make sense. As for perks, I always was able to play my classes fine playing normal. perhaps you are spend too thin or trying to focuse too much.

» Sun Jul 08, 2012 12:20 am

Gents, I'm surprised and at the same time amused that all of you have not only been feeding the troll, but taking this guys "arguement" seriously. I lurk and spend a lot of time in the Gamefaqs Skyrim (360) forums, so maybe I have a keen eye for trolls. For the sake of staying on topic, TC ... use your damn imagination. Your question has been answered multiple times and your "counter arguements" destroyed. It's an RPG, and it's not the game restricting you from how you want to play, you're restricting yourself.

Damn, I bit >.<

Troll? I provide valid points and defend my opinion on why this game needs a class system. Calling me a troll to aid your argument is petty and ridiculous.

» Sat Jul 07, 2012 9:30 pm

So you just don't like jack of all trades? Never seen the problem since one it is a single player game and two they are also the master of non and suffer for it. As for destruction magic I can see where your coming from. Would indeed make sense to have a check for skill level. I do think that it is harder to acquire the skills if your low level since merchants don't sell them however, but the skill check would still make sense. As for perks, I always was able to play my classes fine playing normal. perhaps you are spend too thin or trying to focuse too much.

Being a jack of all trades takes the fun out of the game. Doing everything with ease isnt fun and there is no point in playing a game that provides so little challenge.

» Sat Jul 07, 2012 9:35 am

Being a jack of all trades takes the fun out of the game. Doing everything with ease isnt fun and there is no point in playing a game that provides so little challenge.

If you feel that way, then don't play a Jack of all Trades.

God I hate people like this. "I don't like something that means no one else can have it!"

Same reason why Spell making is gone.

» Sat Jul 07, 2012 3:33 pm

Spoken like a true mainstream gamer. Classes and how they function has been the foundation of Elder Scrolls and how you played your character. Now, i find a warhammer on the ground and swing despite my original intentions on the class. The skill level has nothing to do with effectiveness besides letting you get perks. Perks are the only thing that count in this game, which is sad really. Makes it feel like im buying something rather than earning it through progression.

so I am mainstream because I do not agree with you? And as I said before classes are still in game. Now if it was a system where the skill raised and you acquired perks as it raised and were not restricted to certain skills I would consider that classless. Skyrim in its current form is. It classless. And a lot of RPGs I have seen have you buy everything. Take fallout, you actually put skill points into each skill when you level. You can learn to use a gun by using a hammer. Atleast with skyrim you actually have to use the skill to be able to put points into it. You can't become a master Mage without having used magic or atleast trained it.

» Sat Jul 07, 2012 11:57 pm

Being a jack of all trades takes the fun out of the game. Doing everything with ease isnt fun and there is no point in playing a game that provides so little challenge.

Again singleplayer game. If you can't restrain yourself that is your problem.

» Sat Jul 07, 2012 7:28 pm

If you feel that way, then don't play a Jack of all Trades.

God I hate people like this. "I don't like something that means no one else can have it!"

Same reason why Spell making is gone.

Then they should make it a damned sand-box game where u can give urself everything. Like a chest at the beginning that has all ingame items and u choose if you want to take them or not. Also have a dude that can max out all the skills you want. Not everyone has to do it, its an option.

» Sat Jul 07, 2012 12:38 pm

You dont plan out anything in skyrim. Its all in a skill tree. You level on the spot with NO thinking. You use a warhammer, u level 2 handed.

Makes sense to me.

Before Skyrim, you could level up, lets say, conjuration (and any other skill) by literally only running around with a warhammer.... Now that is a flawed system. Now you can select perks in conjuration, but you cant reach any more perks until you actual reach the skill level by actually CONJURING.

» Sat Jul 07, 2012 12:28 pm

Before Skyrim, you could level up, lets say, conjuration (and any other skill) by literally only running around with a warhammer.... Now that is a flawed system. Now you can get perks, but you cant reach any perks until you actual reach the skill level by CONJURING.

How? you used the skills you had and they leveled as you used them

» Sat Jul 07, 2012 11:41 pm

Then they should make it a damned sand-box game where u can give urself everything. Like a chest at the beginning that has all ingame items and u choose if you want to take them or not. Also have a dude that can max out all the skills you want. Not everyone has to do it, its an option.

That is the opposite extreme and using an extreme is not supporting you wanting to restrict the game. You can go the opposite extreme where your forced into one class with one set of equipment and one skill. Don't think anyone wants an extreme.

» Sat Jul 07, 2012 3:31 pm

Makes sense to me.

Before Skyrim, you could level up, lets say, conjuration (and any other skill) by literally only running around with a warhammer.... Now that is a flawed system. Now you can select perks in conjuration, but you cant reach any more perks until you actual reach the skill level by actually CONJURING.

wait how? Do you mean though training because you are being trained in it. Didn't see that as implausible and training a skill you don't use seems a little ridiculous any way.