[hannah sillery]

ESO is an open world MMO, where you can go anywhere and do anything. There is no set path for you to level, in-fact it has been clarified that you are able to level up in whatever way you please.

--You can do quests, you can kill monsters, you can PvP to 50. When you do things such as quests, it forms the world around you, to how you wanted it to be. For example, you want someone to die during a quest or objective? There , he's dead, you won't see him again. You don't save the building from burning down? There, its not there anymore, and its not coming back.

This is a huge mixture between Theme Park style and Sandbox style MMO's, while you have general questing, PvP and exploration, there are sandbox elements such as you changing the world around you.

--End Game, the end game is what you want it to be, there arn't any raids at launch, so that means you'll have to do other things in your time, like explore to a different province still changing the world around you to fit your playstyle (an element of Sandbox MMO's mixed in with Theme Park style)

--Perks and Skills, see this is where things get really interesting. You have 4 classes that arn't entitled to do anything but what you want them to do. You want a Sorceress that specializes in two handed combat? You can have that. You want a Dragon Knight that uses a staff and throws fire in peoples face, you can do that. You can't do that in Theme Park MMO's. World of Warcraft, a Mage can't dual wield daggers, use two handed swords, and a linear skill path is set out for you, whereas, in ESO, took more of a Sandbox approach to the skills, and perks. You're not forced into any specific category, you can do anything you want, at any specific time. WoW? Can't do it, have to be Fire, Frost or Arcane.

--Race customization, this is very interesting, because from what some of the new articles are saying, it has almost as much customization with all the different sliders you can use to create your character. Fat, short, tall, skinny, wide, green, white, black, cheek bones, pigment, and many more. This is a Sandbox element, because it lets you decide what you want to look like. You don't have to pick a pre-created face to start like most other Theme Park MMO's.

--Crafting, with what we know of all the different crafting abilities available, we know it takes on more traits of an ElderScrolls game, than an MMO game. Which means you're alchemist will have to try, test all the different herbs to find out what each one does, and what mixes best with what. Hardly a linear experience, I haven't heard too much on Blacksmithing or any of the other professions yet, but if it relates to anything like previous ElderScrolls titles than you know you are going to have an awesome crafting experience full of exploration. Which isn't a typical theme park style.

With all of this information provided, i've come to the conclusion that ESO has a very nice mixture of Theme Park styles and Sandbox styles of gameplay. If you want to go in a straight path and do the quests, you can, if you want to choose your own path to leveling you're character you are able to do so. Having a good mixture is a very healthy thing for a game, because you're not just catering to one side.

[Sammi Jones]

Looks like a good mix so far.

[Sarah Kim]

Looks like a good mix so far.

[ShOrty]

I would say the game is mostly a theme park style MMO with a good mix of Sandbox in it.

We can't exactly level where ever we like. The zones are leveled, so some will be for 20-29 other 40-45. That's pretty theme park right there. It's just they gave us more freedom on how we want to do the quests in the zone. We won't have to do one hub to unlock another hub. And ZOS said that if you don't explore you will miss quests that are just out in the wilderness.

But so far I'm very excited for the direction they are taking this game. A very good mix of the Elder Scrolls series and MMO mechanics too.

[TWITTER.COM]

I'm already blown away by some of the sandbox elements in it, and I'm glad there's some of the most improtant things, and at the same time some of the most important things of a TES game. All and all, themepark or no themepark, the sandbox part is what I'm loving.

[maya papps]

OP, /agree.

Now if they'd add housing I might have a another 8 year subscription replacement for SWG.

[Brian LeHury]

Looks more like 'themepark with some superficial sandbox shout-outs' to me. Better than what most are offering these days, but I'd still hesitate on even calling it a hybrid.

Couple major points:
1) You can sort of affect changes on the world, but doing so is strictly a quest-driven process that's locked away in phases. That's pretty much the definition of "themepark with a superficial sandbox shout-out" IMO.

2) "End game" is really a theme-park conceit in itself. Sandboxes don't really have a clearly delineated 'end game' as such; they have a variety of different world elements and tools to interact with them with more developed characters being able to do so more effectively, but it's players rather than system mechanics that control when players get involved.
Then again, that concept could very likely be what Matt was getting at when he said "we don't really have an endgame."

3) Aesthetic character customization isn't really a sandbox/themepark issue in itself. CoX had one of the most robust character-customization elements on the market at it's time, and it was very blatantly a themepark game. By contrast: UO and EveO, two of the 'classic sandboxes,' had only very rudimentary levels of customization at the start.

[Eileen Collinson]

OP, /agree.

Now if they'd add housing I might have a another 8 year subscription replacement for SWG.

ZOS said that they would add player/guild housing later on if there are a lot of people in the community that are asking for it. It won't be in at launch though, they've specifically have said that.

[Kayla Keizer]

Mostly themepark, but with a healthy dose of sandbox. Could have a bit more sand.

[Danial Zachery]

The only things I'm so far disappointed by is the actual use of classes(just being able to choose which combat trees by yourself is better imo) and the instancing/phasing of the game. Honestly, is it really that hard to make a seamless world, or even a continent? Having to go through a loading screen from zone to zone will definitely make the world feel less open and real. Other than that ESO appears to be delivering.

[Chad Holloway]

I hate this false dichotomy. It doesn't tell you anything about the game when you group games like ESO and WoW in the same "themepark" category. The ultimate sandbox is a pipedream, your freedom will always be limited by boundaries and rules. These boundaries have always been a continuum for each individual feature, not something where you can put a knife to it at some point and divide it into two arbitrary categories. As it stands, ESO seems to be as much a "theme park" or a "sandbox" as Skyrim, with some concessions to a multiplayer environment.

Also, I specifically don't see how leveled zones are a "themepark" feature; to me, the exact opposite would be true. The world shouldn't scale to your likings, that has nothing to do with an open sandbox experience. Sure I should be able to go there, but if it is too dangerous for my level, I should get my butt kicked.

[Shannon Marie Jones]

I like that idear with phasing, but i think it also bring a few problems with it.

First a friend of you has a different status in a quest or you choose different ways of ending this quest. Now you have a quest where you have to escort the person to a village but your friend killed him off already. So know your friend has to wait until you finish your quest.

[Trista Jim]

Themepark and nope TESO is not an open world mmo.

[Kristina Campbell]

there is lore, there are factions, there are quests, there is a main story line, there is no housing, there is no content without fighting, there is no free moving through the world, there is no PvP where ever when ever you want, etc.

there are so many things that make ESO clearly a theme park MMO.


maybe it's a theme park with multiple choices but that is far away from a sandbox game.

[Joey Avelar]

It is theme-park no questions ask though there are some freedoms, to compare it it would be more like a large miniature golf park, more freedom restrictions are less but still a theme park.

and only area that seems to be open is just Cyrodil.

[Sammygirl500]

there is lore, there are factions, there are quests, there is a main story line, there is no housing, there is no content without fighting, there is no free moving through the world, there is no PvP where ever when ever you want, etc.

Crossed out the main bits that weren't actually relevant to the topic of 'theme park vs sandbox.'
Last one is probably the most contentious, but with ATITD being among the sandiest of the sandboxes I feel secure in removing it.
(Housing is sketchy as well, but I left it in anyway.)

maybe it's a theme park with multiple choices but that is far away from a sandbox game.

This, though, I agree with.

[Jack Moves]

there is lore, there are factions, there are quests, there is a main story line, there is no housing, there is no content without fighting, there is no free moving through the world, there is no PvP where ever when ever you want, etc.

Of course there's content without fighting. What makes you say there isn't?

[Reven Lord]

Crossed out the main bits that weren't actually relevant to the topic of 'theme park vs sandbox.'
Last one is probably the most contentious, but with ATITD being among the sandiest of the sandboxes I feel secure in removing it.
(Housing is sketchy as well, but I left it in anyway.)

but of course these are the most relevant things in a sandbox game

having factions and lore and no option to start a war with anyone is as much sandbox as playing LEGO with the restriction to only build houses and cars

[NO suckers In Here]

Looks more like 'themepark with some superficial sandbox shout-outs' to me. Better than what most are offering these days, but I'd still hesitate on even calling it a hybrid.

I agree.

People seem to have different ideas about what makes a sandbox a sandbox. Eg. I don't see an open character development system as being at all sandbox. It just often goes hand in hand with what does make a game a sandbox and this is where players have a great deal of influence over the gameworld and are the primary content.

The thing about players making story choices that effect the world is those choices don't affect THE world, but a personal version of it. For me that's not really sandbox.

In my view TESO has only one sandbox aspect - Cyrodil. If it's substantial enough then it might qualify the end-game as a hybrid.

[Honey Suckle]

Of course there's content without fighting. What makes you say there isn't?

you can grow your own trees?
you can build a house?
you can keep some animals?
you can craft furniture?


what makes you think there is content without fighting?
I don't count weapon and armor crafting as 'nothing to do with fighting'
neither would I say that any stupid errand is any content at all, if I'd like to read some story I go and get a book

[noa zarfati]

you can grow your own trees?
you can build a house?
you can keep some animals?
you can craft furniture?


what makes you think there is content without fighting?
I don't count weapon and armor crafting as 'nothing to do with fighting'
neither would I say that any stupid errand is any content at all, if I'd like to read some story I go and get a book

Not having a specific feature doesn't mean there's 'no content without fighting'. So what's with the examples? Again, false dichotomy.
Of course crafting is content without fighting, even if you craft weapons. So is fishing, lockpicking, and other minigames. Quests even encourage you to avoid fighting with sneaking and disguises. If you want to redefine this as non-content or a subset of fighting to make your argument work, that's not my problem, I was responding to your initial claim.

I guess some people want Minecraft with Daedric Pickaxes, but there's more to TES than that, IMO. Including lore, factions, quests and a main story line.

[Kayleigh Williams]

ESO is an open world MMO, where you can go anywhere and do anything. There is no set path for you to level, in-fact it has been clarified that you are able to level up in whatever way you please.

Wrong. TESO is not an open world MMO and no i can't go anywhere at anytime. Being able to level up anyway you want is not a sandbox feature, fact is that if i don't do quest i'm am no going to progress. Does TESO have instances, is there zoning between each zone, can i go to the other faction areas from level one without coming across any barrier's. The answer to all of this is a big fat NO.



--You can do quests, you can kill monsters, you can PvP to 50. When you do things such as quests, it forms the world around you, to how you wanted it to be. For example, you want someone to die during a quest or objective? There , he's dead, you won't see him again. You don't save the building from burning down? There, its not there anymore, and its not coming back.

LOL, you can do quest, kill monsters, level 50 PVP, really lol, phasing has nothing to do with sandbox gaming. In fact everything you have described and tried to convince us is sandbox is actually as themepark as it can get lol.

This is a huge mixture between Theme Park style and Sandbox style MMO's, while you have general questing, PvP and exploration, there are sandbox elements such as you changing the world around you.

You are not changing the world around you, it's called phasing, i can't build a fort from scratch, i can plant crops or build a house from nothing but materials i've harvested. And nope instance housing is not a sandbox feature.

--End Game, the end game is what you want it to be, there arn't any raids at launch, so that means you'll have to do other things in your time, like explore to a different province still changing the world around you to fit your playstyle (an element of Sandbox MMO's mixed in with Theme Park style)

Again, see the above and yes you can go to an INSTANCED version of another faction area..so much for your open world claim lol.

--Perks and Skills, see this is where things get really interesting. You have 4 classes that arn't entitled to do anything but what you want them to do. You want a Sorceress that specializes in two handed combat? You can have that. You want a Dragon Knight that uses a staff and throws fire in peoples face, you can do that. You can't do that in Theme Park MMO's. World of Warcraft, a Mage can't dual wield daggers, use two handed swords, and a linear skill path is set out for you, whereas, in ESO, took more of a Sandbox approach to the skills, and perks. You're not forced into any specific category, you can do anything you want, at any specific time. WoW? Can't do it, have to be Fire, Frost or Arcane.

The skill system is more open than your typical locked in style of games like WOW but it's still a themepark system. The game has classes and i can't learn other class abilities unless i'm that class no matter if i can use any weapon. Sandbox MMO don't have classes and every single skill in the game is available for me learn, this is not the case with TESO.



--Race customization, this is very interesting, because from what some of the new articles are saying, it has almost as much customization with all the different sliders you can use to create your character. Fat, short, tall, skinny, wide, green, white, black, cheek bones, pigment, and many more. This is a Sandbox element, because it lets you decide what you want to look like. You don't have to pick a pre-created face to start like most other Theme Park MMO's.

This is the most foolish thing you have said to try and put your sandbox claim over to us lol, everything you describe is pretty standard in most themepark MMO's of today.

--Crafting, with what we know of all the different crafting abilities available, we know it takes on more traits of an ElderScrolls game, than an MMO game. Which means you're alchemist will have to try, test all the different herbs to find out what each one does, and what mixes best with what. Hardly a linear experience, I haven't heard too much on Blacksmithing or any of the other professions yet, but if it relates to anything like previous ElderScrolls titles than you know you are going to have an awesome crafting experience full of exploration. Which isn't a typical theme park style.

If crafting was sandbox then every single item in the game should be player made, point blank no room for discussion. I should be able to craft anything in the game, their should be no crafting profession that are locked out from me.

With all of this information provided, i've come to the conclusion that ESO has a very nice mixture of Theme Park styles and Sandbox styles of gameplay. If you want to go in a straight path and do the quests, you can, if you want to choose your own path to leveling you're character you are able to do so. Having a good mixture is a very healthy thing for a game, because you're not just catering to one side.

Nope with the information you have provided it's clear that TESO is a themepark MMO and you have no idea what makes an MMO a sandbox game. Now don't get me wrong that TESO sound really interesting but make no mistake that the game is a themepark and not even a hybrid.

[Luna Lovegood]

Until they get rid of instances, it's theme park.

[Ludivine Poussineau]

but of course these are the most relevant things in a sandbox game

having factions and lore and no option to start a war with anyone is as much sandbox as playing LEGO with the restriction to only build houses and cars

At this point, I can only conclude that you're mocking the very idea of sandboxes with some brand of appeal to ridicule.

[Dean]

Until they get rid of instances, it's theme park.

A sand-box game can have instances, depending on how it is instance.