I know. I've told him that before as well. Bethesda just needs not to screw its fans/roleplayers...

It does a better job then most other companies...

Nevertheless, the error still stands...

Some posts with the ridiculous platform preening or bashing went away... honestly kids.

Also, fixed the topic title. I'm sure no flame or rudeness to hardworking people was intended, right?

Was such an awesome quote, just have to say!

Anyway, I do agree with most of what you said. I had no idea that the Vampires and Werewolves were so far off from lore, as I never played Morrowind. Kinda annoys me that people break lore just to appease people... UGH...

First off, I'd like to say I LOVED being a Vampire before the patch, now I feel like a guy wlaking around with a disease... I don't even feel like a true Vampire anymore.. Even with the Vampire Lord ability, unless I'm in that form, I'm not really worthy of being called one, I guess... I enjoyed the challenge of maintaining my Vampirism, now that means absolutely nothing. The only thing we got was an ability that IS THE COMPELTE OPPOSITE of what Vampires are built for: Stealth.

Second, I think the complete nerfing of the challenge when being a Vampire to be really unnecessary and frustrating... I like feeling like an outcast, now that means nothing. On top of that I have bright glowing eyes (Ffs stupid NPCs, how can you not see that), you should have just given us glittering skin, would fit with us having to rescue some vampire chick from her evil father. *Cough* TWILIGHT GUARD *Cough*. Its really just kinda ridiculous that I have to change otherwise I have none of my "True Vampire" abilities. Aren't Vampires supposed to be Vampires without changing? I know Runescapes Vyrewatch are like this, though, but they did that really well.

Last, some of the features of the Vampire Lord, and even the form itself are kinda ridiculous... I completely agree with the second strain idea, not whatever this is... I'm a Vampire but I'm not one... Ok? Also, the ability to feed on NPCs after using your Seduction Power makes complete sense, but it should only be able to do that from stage 4 (Maybe Stage 3) onward. The Bats ability was just cheesy and completely unnecessary, it doesn't really fit... The vastly different form and having to change to get any sort of benefit also was a major buzzkill.. The Vampire Lord doesn't look as epic as I pictured either, wish he looked better..

So... Even though I was very negative in the above paragraphs, I am enjoying this DLC. Being a Vampire Lord and destroying Dragons and NPCs is insanely fun, as well as the new quests and items.

dont know why the title was changed.
bethesda DID screw up in many,many places with this dlc.

yep...hate to say it...but im done with bethesda ....

Awww I liked the title Vampires In Skyrim and The Bethesda (S)crew.

I liked some of the stuff in dawnguard (crossbows and the Vl and werewolf perk trees), but what kinda bugs me is this:

1. Why can't you choose to obey Harkon and Blot out the sun for good? It doesn't make sense as to why you can't (as it was heavily advertised)

2. What's the point of having all this dialogue with Serana that makes you somewhat bond with her and you can't even make her your bride?

3. What was the point of putting the snow elves in that slight part of dawnguard? Bethesda, you could've saved them for another DLC and add ALOT more depth to it; this just kind of left me disapointed.

4. What new tactics do these Legendary Dragons use? Because aside from the two in the questline, i've yet to see anything new besides that drain vitality shout.

5. Was it really that hard to have Actual Werewolves (given that you added wild ones) be called with the Totem of Brotherhood perk? Though the red ones are helpful, it was a bit of a let down.

6. Vampire Lords are friggin awsome, but shouldn't they have more reprecussions? because despite stage four penalties, i can still slaughter every killable person in any of the nine holds day or night. How bout they can only transform at night?

7. Whats the Point of having the player pick a side if it doesnt end with the other side being crushed? (like in the civil war quests) At the very least I would've liked some more quests that made you specifically target the Dawnguard/Vampires instead of just being enemies you commonly encounter during the main questline?

8. Why even make the player pick a side when he/she will get the other side's advantages as well by the end of the questline?

9. Why can't vampire use the ratway makeover!?!?!?


those were what bugged me, but dont get me wrong I still did enjoy some parts of it and it gave me another reason to venture once more in the land of skyrim; here's hoping for a patch to fix some of these things or some of the other things people above listed so i'll stay for a lot longer

Don't worry, guys. Modders will fix everything. (At least for PC)

I had a bit of a discussion about this. Dawnguard was heavily disappointing. I feel I could have used my money elsewhere. I feel like Bethseda just added whatever was cool into Skyrim. Snow Elves they are mysterious, and cool, add them in. Dragons, they are cool, awesome, add them in. Anything that could and would be awesome was added in to make a pile of crap, imo. This is prisoner gruel they have decided to feed us, instead of giving us something with a little more depth.

Your first meeting with Harkon should have went three ways:

-I refuse your gift, but I'd like to help. Seeing as you save Serana Harkon obliges.

-I accept your gift, and help you.

-I refuse your gift and swear to kill you all, I'm not the prey, you are

Again Bethseda took the worse route. To even have a game you're forced into a decision. Okay being a Vampire Lord is awesome, but still you add replayability the other way around. Now let's say you don't accept Harkon's gift, but convince him that you'll help him. Well then now you could have someone from the Dawnguard, seeing as you're sitll mortal, try to convince you unto the other side.

And there should have been three choices at the end:

-Aid Serana

-Aid yourself; kill Serana and Harkon

-Aid Harkon; destroy the sun

Bethseda is really lacking in the department of choices. Which is saying something because I understand there was only one ending in Shivering Isles, but you still had choices. Choices of gatekeeper parts, to aid he seducers or saints and even convince them of different tactical play throughs, assassinate either demenia or madness, etc. Bethseda is capable of it. They just didn't add it. And that's what makes Dawnguard so disappointing. Linearity with very few replayability.

Wild werewolves......

YES. New thing to hunt!

To the main point. Dawnguard certainly wasn't bad, but it could've been better. I was hoping this DLC wasn't based on one quest line, because I knew I would do it once, and never touch it again. The new areas were okay, not worth revisiting. I was not a fan of the soul cairn, it was rather boring.

You won't get those eyes if you were a regular vampire beforehand it seems.

My vampire lord is stuck with the yellow and orange eyes that the regular vampires have. Not that I'm complaining of course, I love those eyes.

That is not true at all, both my vamps were vamps pre-DG and they have sunlit eyes

yep same here.

Really? Well then, that's an interesting bug.

What are their genders and races?

I just need to say... legends are often magnified, exaggerated or just wrong. It's why they're called legends instead of history....

Male Breton and Male Dunmer

Movarth proves the description right in the book by returning alive, and he is even in Skyrim now

Interesting, I have a female Breton and I have the yellow and orange eyes.

Now I'm tempted to test this out...

Well i have also had a Female Altmer, Male Altmer, Male Khajiit, and Male Argonian go Vamp in DG to test and the beast races have their original eyes from before DG and the other 2 had the new glowys

I'm aware of the beast races, it's the orange or gold eyes that I'm interested in. I have a friend who has the gold eyes, but his character wasn't a vampire first so I attributed it to that.

During the Beta we threw in all out occurances of each eye set and we found no common denominator. We assume it is a bug

This thread has gone back in time!

This. With the DG release, I was toying with the idea of going WW again, hoping the DLC would revise them into a fun option with wild encounters, forced transformations and improved strength through serious upgrades in their perk system... Now I see it's all still FUBAR.