Did the Game Jam video tick you off?

Post » Sun Jun 10, 2012 8:37 am

They produced an excellent game as it is, and missing release dates can spell disaster. Running past release date is never a good thing. People lose jobs over that, and companies can lose huge amounts of money in development costs from time-schedule overruns. Obviously they needed to hit the Christmas season with this game; overshooting the release date in a time when there is such a thing as the internet and post-release patches is just not good.

It would be one thing if the game weren't playable as released, but it in fact was very stable for the vast majority of users. I've had several CTDs, which are no problem since I save regularly (some 3,200 saves by level 45) and I've had a few graphical burps, like a nigh-invisible dragon. Most of those could be resolved by quitting and restarting. Nothing serious, and almost everybody is in that same situation. There are a handful of people who have had serious problems, but they are, again, a relative handful.

While I agree that marriage seems like a half-baked feature, the sheer quality of the game astonishes, from the excellent key voice actors to the awesome stories of the return of Alduin, the Companions and their big secret, the Civil War, and all the background information you get about the ancient times when Ysgramor returned to avenge...well, you know what he came to avenge.

But anybody that complains about this game should go and do one thing before continuing to blab about how bad it is, and how big a disappointment it is, and how they feel betrayed by Bethesda, or Microsoft and Sony, or Todd Howard, or whoever. Go and watch the http://reckoning.amalur.com/ Go watch those, then go play Skyrim for an hour. Go walk through the towns, and the forests, and the mountains, and see the glaciers and the snowstorms; go see the aroura-rise at night - and then remember how cartoonish and worthless Kingdoms of Amalur looks in comparison.

Games get postponed all the time, they shouldn't have committed to a release date so early, games should be done when they're done. I would've waited a year maybe two, hell I would've waited for the next generation of consoles if we got a truly great experience. Voice actors are meh as far as I have experienced, the writing is drab, the stories manage to fall extremely flat, quests are extremely redundant, the loot svcks, npcs are boring, magic is stripped, there is no feeling of real interaction or change in the world...I'm sure I could keep going and I'm sure others could feel in complaints. Is it fun? Yeah sure but I was expecting more, and seeing all their cool ideas at game jam made me realize that if they took the time and effort they really could have taken things to the next level had they been willing to. Is the world pretty? Of course it is but nice environs do not make for a great game.
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Haley Cooper
 
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Post » Sun Jun 10, 2012 10:39 am

Games get postponed all the time, they shouldn't have committed to a release date so early, games should be done when they're done. I would've waited a year maybe two, hell I would've waited for the next generation of consoles if we got a truly great experience. Voice actors are meh as far as I have experienced, the writing is drab, the stories manage to fall extremely flat, quests are extremely redundant, the loot svcks, npcs are boring, magic is stripped, there is no feeling of real interaction or change in the world...I'm sure I could keep going and I'm sure others could feel in complaints. Is it fun? Yeah sure but I was expecting more, and seeing all their cool ideas at game jam made me realize that if they took the time and effort they really could have taken things to the next level had they been willing to. Is the world pretty? Of course it is but nice environs do not make for a great game.

Environments alone do not make a game, that's true - but great visuals are simply mandatory for this sort of game. They aren't a bonus, they're simply required.

And I do hope you realize the utter impossibility of them delaying the release of the game by two years - and waiting for the next generation of consoles? Utterly impossible. They already waited five years since the last installment in the franchise. Waiting another four or whatever might well have killed the franchise off. If Todd Howard had gone and said "we need to delay release of the game by two years to get it ready" they would have had him out on the street before the end of the day. Then they would have replaced him, probably with somebody from entirely outside the company, but regardless it would have been with somebody whose explicit orders were to "get the damn game released on time". A couple months might have been feasible if the Christmas season weren't looming, but missing the Christmas season was out of the question.

And what more could you want from the voice acting? Aside from some little oddities (Why was Esbern voiced by two different actors?) the voice acting ranges from pretty good to excellent.
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rebecca moody
 
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Post » Sat Jun 09, 2012 10:33 pm

Environments alone do not make a game, that's true - but great visuals are simply mandatory for this sort of game. They aren't a bonus, they're simply required.

And I do hope you realize the utter impossibility of them delaying the release of the game by two years - and waiting for the next generation of consoles? Utterly impossible. They already waited five years since the last installment in the franchise. Waiting another four or whatever might well have killed the franchise off. If Todd Howard had gone and said "we need to delay release of the game by two years to get it ready" they would have had him out on the street before the end of the day. Then they would have replaced him, probably with somebody from entirely outside the company, but regardless it would have been with somebody whose explicit orders were to "get the damn game released on time". A couple months might have been feasible if the Christmas season weren't looming, but missing the Christmas season was out of the question.

And what more could you want from the voice acting? Aside from some little oddities (Why was Esbern voiced by two different actors?) the voice acting ranges from pretty good to excellent.
That's what killed this game is the "get the damn game released on time" attitude. Like I said they committed to 11-11-11 way too early, I think like a year in advance or something? They should have never done that frankly. Like I said games should come out when they are the best they can be. People who enjoy this franchise would have waited and bethesda has enough things going on to pull in cash. I agree 2 years was extreme but a year? I think that would have been okay. New consoles are also rumored to appear in 2014 anyway so it wouldn't have been too much of stretch to do that. Sure it would have been a large gap setting up the possibility to be as disappointing as the last George R.R. Martin book but I think the time would have only helped. And not every game needs a holiday release. Look at Mass Effect 3, it's coming out in March and it is just as big of a release as Skyrim. The voice acting isn't terrible, it's okay but a lot of it feels uninspired or riddled with terrible accents. And when it comes down to it it's not only needing more time it's how they spent the time they had, I understand a game like this takes a lot of work, probably more than I know but I feel like they could have delivered something better.
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Soph
 
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Post » Sun Jun 10, 2012 2:21 am

Well, I agree that there are weak points, but as I said earlier in this thread, it seems that Bethesda is pretty committed to support for their games, and I don't mean just squashing bugs. They're still working on tinkering with existing game mechanics and even possibly introducing new ones. And then for cosmetic changes we have mods - which are only possible because Bethesda has intentionally worked to make the game easily moddable.

I get your point about Mass Effect 3, but the ME people knew that an ME release in time for Christmas was simply impossible, and so there's no point in trying to do the impossible. A Christmas release was possible for Skyrim, and I think that they made the right decision overall: get it out on time and then patch it, rather than delay it and miss the Christmas season.

After all, profitability is what convinces the guys in the boardroom to allow the development teams to spend more time with the game. If sales are hurt, they have to make up for that by cutting development time. A good, hefty batch of sales from the Christmas season gives them a lot more wiggle room in terms of telling the development team "Hey, sales figures are really doing well, after Christmas you guys keep working on Skyrim, make some improvements, let's see if we can get the buzz to continue and see how long we can get these sales to keep going." This is much better than "Well, guys, we missed the Christmas buying season, and that kinda hurt sales pretty bad. Sales aren't doing badly, but they aren't quite what we hoped, so we have to compensate by limiting development costs. We can still work on some patches for bugs, but we can't sink more time and money into developing new features for the game. The sales just don't justify it. So let's get some bug patches out, then we gotta move on to the next game."
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ZANEY82
 
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Post » Sun Jun 10, 2012 4:37 am

Was there a video attached? I was too busy eating popcorn and reading posts from a bunch of advlts acting like three-year old entitlement babies.

MMOs thataway --------------------->

Please go there...
Welcome to the most overused meaningless fashionable phrase from the last several years, namely "entitlement" or having a "sense of entitlement"
Originally used by Warcraft players as an attack on casual players, it has since been used all around the world by [censored] looking to defend their hero against what is often acceptable and constructive criticism.
Please grimgryphon never use this phrase again and come up with your own opinions about what is really going on here rather than just spewing words you read one time and decided it sounded cool.
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M!KkI
 
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Post » Sat Jun 09, 2012 7:01 pm

Games get postponed all the time,
You know, postponing games isn't always a garantee that it will actually make the game better. Just look what happened to Duke Nukem, Ruined Forever.

Besides, how do you know Beth had the cash to actually postpone the game a year? You're thinking of Diablo of course. Well the problem is, Blizzard must be rolling in cash to allow another delay in Diablo (which would be logical since they've been collecting monthly subscriptions from millions of people for years now).

Skyrim has quite a few flaws and nobody will deny it, but it simply is a good game and in my opnion, it is (or will become) the best of breed in the TES series.
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Prohibited
 
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Post » Sat Jun 09, 2012 10:33 pm

You know, postponing games isn't always a garantee that it will actually make the game better. Just look what happened to Duke Nukem, Ruined Forever.

Besides, how do you know Beth had the cash to actually postpone the game a year? You're thinking of Diablo of course. Well the problem is, Blizzard must be rolling in cash to allow another delay in Diablo (which would be logical since they've been collecting monthly subscriptions from millions of people for years now).

Skyrim has quite a few flaws and nobody will deny it, but it simply is a good game and in my opnion, it is (or will become) the best of breed in the TES series.

I don't and it doesn't but it could have. Frankly I doubt it could have been made any worse than it is, perhaps more buggy but there are patches for that.
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Elina
 
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Post » Sun Jun 10, 2012 9:06 am

I don't see why the Game Jam would tick anyone off. My understanding was that it was created by individuals on their own computers for maybe a couple of scenes. They weren't checking to see if it might cause bugs throughout the game - just messing around to illustrate stuff they liked and made that they wouldn't mind seeing used. These were not - from what I understood - fully fleshed out features.
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Marcia Renton
 
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Post » Sat Jun 09, 2012 11:44 pm

I don't and it doesn't but it could have. Frankly I doubt it could have been made any worse than it is, perhaps more buggy but there are patches for that.
I'm curious. How is it a bad game then? Have you played other games these past years, and have you followed the trend in the gaming industry?

What Skyrim does is quite frankly unique. Almost every AAA developer is going for the railroaded 10hrs max sp gaming experience, and to hide that they've made their game half-arsed they add useless features like co-op, multiplayer or go MMO.

Maybe because of that my standards are lowered but Skyrim is a good enough game. Now that the CK is released it can only get much better.
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candice keenan
 
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Post » Sun Jun 10, 2012 12:39 am

Well, I wouldn't call multiplayer a "useless feature". It doesn't fit TES, but I love a good multiplayer game. It's popular for good reason.

But I agree that lots of game developers seem to be going with fairly narrow sorts of games.
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Leonie Connor
 
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Post » Sun Jun 10, 2012 12:51 am


I suppose "12" is your age.

They've not added nothing.
Todd Howard is the executive producer and simply do his job (very well if you ask me) you can't call him a "liar" because his work is to sell you an entertainment product and this "game jam" is nothing more than a "joke" for the "moaning children" that call him and the developers team "liars", accuse them of "laziness" etc.
He's tried to explain that some "spectacular" features have been cutted off/removed for various and valid reasons and maybe only some of those things you've seen in the video will be included in a future Dlc.

And i personally think that the essential ones like mounted combat,footprints etc. are already in advanced development for future dlcs.

Remember also that consoles can't run properly some of the "heavy" graphics add-ons like seasonal foliage due to hardware limits so no chance for that ones on xbox360/ps3.

For "the rest" well... is the same old story ("Morrowind was the best","oblivion was better","i want back some features from previous games" etc..) but lets put in that way:

-Morrowind:great Rpg,great world design,decent story,npcs all killable,more creatures, levitation,spears,more guilds, no fast travel, consequences on what you did etc.. but too dispersive and "dated"; horrible animations and graphic models (especially the Npcs) and no acting voices so more dialogues option/less immersion (or more for some in that way)

-Oblivion: great action game with some rpg elements; better combat and better graphics,fast travel,spell making,poor main quest/ less immersion ,excellent guilds quests,good daedric quests,oblivion gates and dungeons too repetitive,acting voices/less dialogues,decent world design (exceptional the vegetation) tons of bugs

-Skyrim: extraordinary action game with some rpg elements and a solid lore/background; breathtaking game world,better combat and better graphics,dragons,shouts,civil war,almost decent main quest, very good/excellent guilds and Daedric quests (but Mages guild and companions guild were way too short compared to the Oblivion ones even if well balanced and more focused ) exceptional dungeons design (and yes there is even one dungeon without "artificial lights" near Riften populated only by cave bears if you seek for it) possibility to be a werewolf in the vanilla game,perks,dual wielding,killing animations,Black Reach,the dwarfs ruins and a credible "underworld" at last (just think about the possibility of a Dlc settled in the past with giant/dwarfs and stuff like this in the same game world but in a different era..) etc.

in short: Bethesda have added tons of things that the community have requested for years in the past ..yes, even marriage and fast travel..but hey..they're completely optional and no one forces you to wear an amulet and marry the first stranger you encounter (marriable npc) or to rp and don't use fast travel at all...

but you know the lazy human being prefer moaning and complaining behind a pc instead of think positive and understand that Skyrim is a masterpiece -maybe unfinished and certainly with his flaws- and most of all that Todd Howard and Bethesda have their targets and budget/time restrictions to deal with and even other projects/things to do in the meantime.
I know what you mean. People asked for options now they're complaining because they have to many. Or too little, as some would moan on.
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Andrew
 
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Post » Sun Jun 10, 2012 9:38 am

I'm curious. How is it a bad game then? Have you played other games these past years, and have you followed the trend in the gaming industry?

What Skyrim does is quite frankly unique. Almost every AAA developer is going for the railroaded 10hrs max sp gaming experience, and to hide that they've made their game half-arsed they add useless features like co-op, multiplayer or go MMO.

Maybe because of that my standards are lowered but Skyrim is a good enough game. Now that the CK is released it can only get much better.

Did I say it was bad? I don't believe I did...BUT since you asked: Lame quests, terrible writing, non-existant dialogue, lack of choices or consequences, lack of filler npcs that make the realm feel populated, too many npcs that I can talk to but are totally boring or uninspired, small towns, lack of unique weapons and armor, lack of armor types, too many cookie cutter dungeons, lack of creatures to fight, no spellmaking/lack of spells, vampires are lackluster, should have more non leveled items and enemies, companions are uninteresting, guilds could be better, bugs, many useless perks, combat could be more interesting & dynamic, lack of weapon types/variety. Idk that's all I can think of off the top of head. Is skyrim bad? No I would say 7/10 tops though. Maybe it was the fact that I really hyped it up in my mind, maybe it's that after Oblivion and Fallout 3 I was expecting something a little more innovative, but it was a disappointment. Certainly not bad, just not deserving of all the rampant praise it gets.
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Silvia Gil
 
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Post » Sat Jun 09, 2012 9:49 pm

200+ posts, time to close this.
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Jodie Bardgett
 
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