Spell-crafting wasn't perfect but I'd rather have it than nothing. Having said that a re-imagining of the system would be nice.

For me it was more about making me feel like a real experimenting mage and taking my learning somewhere.

Want it back. Among many other things.

It was definitely possible. It just needed some extra effort on Bethesda's part to cope with the random effects that could be produced, but they would also be free to limit compatibility between spells. Unfortunately, like many features that were or weren't in the game, they couldn't be bothered.

This is what I think DLC should be for. Sure, it means they can milk me of all my money but if they make features they left out and sold them to me later I'd snap it up. Admittedly I'd feel like some strung out drug addict getting fleeced by a dealer.

I'm sure they have their reasons.

Alot of what was in the gamejam should be in the game in the first place as far as i'm concerned, but as it is, i'd still pay for some of those extra features as DLC.

Ugh, another topic on Spellmaking?? Do we really have to have a new thread on this EVERY... SINGLE... DAY???

Spellmaking is gone because it's not compatible with the current spell mechanics. And I for one would much prefer what we have over Spellmaking. Spellmaking was fun, I loved it, but it's not nearly as important as it's made out to be.

While everything in the gamejam would be great to have in the game in the first place, nothing in the gamejam is worth the delay that would have inevitably happened were they to include all of that stuff.

The game should've been delayed anyway, and not just because of extra content.

I personally would welcome delays if they meant more content. Patience is a virtue and all that jazz.

If it came between Custom spellmaking and actually making Spellcasting fun, I choose fun Spellcasting. Spellmaking in the previous games never made me "Feel like mage", it made me feel like an excel doc. worker trying to find the highest gross yeild for a investment. Pick most effect spell, press button. No nuance, no finesse, no fun.

At least now, spells have behavior, and variables other than Range, it actually makes playing a spellcaster fun. Not just existing as a spellcaster.

Don't take that the wrong way though, I thouroghly enjoyed spellmaking in previous games, the problem was, I didn't enjoy using the spells I lovingly crafted, and as a rule, any time something exists for it's own sake, it's pointless. Where Morrowind's spell system focused on Depth first, and functionality second, Skyrim focuses on functionality and then Depth (Though they never really got around to depth) which in my opinion is how you build a... well, anything. Start with the foundation, add the furniture later.


So what I'm trying to say is, Skyrim's spellcasting is a great starting point. If Spellmaking could be ironed out (I sincerely doubt it's a graphical issue, since they wrote their effects renderer by hand and can modify it in any way needed) Skyrim's magic could be phenominal.

Yes, we do. We will do this every day until wie get the SM back
Persistency can be a virtue.

Unfortunately it's not the only thing we lost. We lost 50% of the magic effects and we lost all the attributes.
Due to these losses, we also lost a lot of items and replayability.

I played Skyrim für 250 hours, and while it is still a good game, i literally saw any possible item combination and tried every perk combination that interested me.
Something that never happened to me before while playing one of the TES games.

I pray to the deadra lords, that some of you are right and the loss of the spellmaker and other things like magic effects and attributes are connected to the limited GPU and CPU power of consoles.
Because if you are, maybe we have a chance, with the next generation of consoles on the horizon, to get these parts back in the next TES game.

PS: I had the feeling that Bethesda was openly mocking me, as one of the novices in the College asked me to try out his new created spell.
It felt like a kick in the groin and an open reminder of what we lost with the absence of the spellmaker.

^Was sad to see Mysticism go, along with many other useful effects.

They didn't do a very good job of shuffling the remaining effects either(Detect Life in the Alteration school?)

A Breton mage would alter his senses to be akin to that of the Khajiit, giving him more awareness, no?

Sure?

The lore actually allows for the removal of schools (Not so much spells themself) because the schools of Magic are artifical constructs created by Vanus Galerion. Myticism was simply the name for spells that weren't understood (And in some cases, couldn't be understood).

More than spellmaking itself, I just hate the punishing lack of variety within spells. Again, it's Barebones.

It's funny that attributes get mentioned though, honestly, even with the lack of attributes, I think the physical development possibilities of your character far surpass that of Oblivion, mostly because of the lack of hard caps. Skyrim is certainly a deeper game than Oblivion ever hoped to be, if you don't agree with that, your notion of true gameplay depth is so far off the mark, as to be in a different country entirely.

Of course, it's not deeper than Morrowind, which didn't get bogged down in the spectacle, though to be honest, Skyrim is a lot closer to Morrowind than I thought it was going to be.

And now they have been understood, most of them have vanished? Awesome.

And what do we have? The ability to wield magic in a hand instead of having it bound to a separate key? And that was worth losing easily half the amount of spells AND spellmaking for you?

I had to install two magic mods just to make a caster character bearable in this game. Spamming the same spell over and over again until you can get the next tier one isn't very magical.

I was never justifying the removal of any spells in that manner. Time and time again I've levied complaints against the lack of variety, I simply enjoy the act of spellcasting in Skyrim far more than any previous game. The only school that I feel is less off than it was before, is Destruction, because it's very nature of optimized DPS with MP consumed was befitting the "Spreadsheet" mentality of previous games.

What's wierd, is, especially with Enchantments, you can see that spellmaking or at least Unique spells can exist. Firey Soultrap, Nightingale's Talon, Frostform... Basically any unique enchatment in game, function wise, can work as a spell. So it's not about an Inability of technology, I think it was just time or laziness, which means maybe there's hope for expansions.

Oh well, look at the bright side: high fire destruction spells make a cool blast

I understand, although destruction appears to have a wider variety of effects than previous games. Runes being my favourite, and the absence of paralysis runes(or the ability to create them) is unfortunate.

I wish they would add it back in.

No argument there.


Not sure what you mean by "hard caps" in Oblivion. Fortifying your Attributes above 100 in Oblivion continuted to add to your carrying capacity, your fatigue, your health, your speed, your magicka, your magicka regen, your chances of pick pockets, etc. Are you saying that Skyrim is deeper because fortifying skills (other than acrobatics and athletics) above 100 in Oblivion had no effect (other than to counter a drain skill effect)?

Yes, a new topic is needed and YES it's much more important that you think.

I find the reasoning for leaving out Spell Making so full of BS it isn't funny.

It was just another thing they didn't feel like doing so instead of taking the time to do it they just cut it out.

Spell Making is VERY IMPORTANT for mages and the fact that this is supposed to be an RPG that allows you to be what you want do what you want for them to remove spell making is a slap in the face of those who like Role Playing mages.

You can be what you want and do what you want, except for making spells.

BS.

^Don't waste your time with him. The first sentence of his post already showed his real intentions, and that's to stifle criticism of Skyrim, as he always does.