So were guns. :wink_smile:

Another viewpoint is how a sniper type weapon would fit into the game style and story. On one you have security who would have access to higher caliber weapons, but resistance fighters would have a harder time acquiring such a weapon. It would be the problem if the developers integrated vehicles or air warfare, one side would be more powerful than the other. Thus, discouraging players from playing as the resistance. Another case would be to have both sides have the same vehicles and equipment virtually destroying any identity other than different skins that the two fractions would have. Implementing a sniper rifle class wouldn't disrupt the character, story or other elements of the game too much. However, it would create another class that would need to be adjusted as well as all other classes to have ways to counter act. (For example, Sniper class starting with low amount of ammo and not being able to receive ammo from soldiers. Another class having a UAV type of equipment to spot the sniper. etc etc.) Even by making a sniping class the discourages camping by utilizing a sort of recon oriented role would be not that useful due to already stated small map size, plus this role seems to have been filled by lighter faster scout style of play which is balanced by not being able to use heavy weapons. Finally, if a sniping system was created so that it required a high amount of skill to accurately hit a target at any distance I believe that most users would abandon it for faster pace class and weapon set up. Therefore I think the developers have opted for the right approach of just having rifles that are capable of reaching out and hitting a person a good distance away while still being damage effective. This DMR set up is more conducive to team play and overall adaptability in a changing environment like the Cargo level or any other mid sized CQB map. Just my 2 cents. Of course we won't know until it comes out.

Not quite, don't wan't to get into an argument but all the weapons invented to kill while unseen would be considered op in a video game.

Its been said that lights can no longer reach higher points than ANY other class, they can only get there faster. I never said that snipers are useless, i said that there will not be snipers firing from across the map, they will be in a knid of medium way becaue of the way that the maps are set out.

I'm not exaggerating or anything. I've got a little bit of experience here as well. Most of it just from Halo and CoD, unfortunately, but experience nonetheless. In MW2 a large portion of a lot of the maps were pretty much complete dead zones because of snipers. You just simply could not take certain paths or step foot in certain areas because you would get blasted by a guy you had no chance of shooting back at.

It REALLY doesn't help that in CoD games you "shoot" from the tip of your forehead, making hiding in windowsills and the like a lot more effective than it should be. But anyway...

I'm just against that kind of low-risk, high-reward sniping. Shotguns can kill really quickly too, but they are risky to use because you have to get close to your enemies and they could easily kill you before you got within optimal shotgun range. High risk, high reward (unless you camp with one, but I hate that too, as you know). With sniper rifles you still get that same ability to kill quickly, but you're also relatively safe while you're doing it. Low risk, high reward. It's just not balanced. If it was, snipers and sniping wouldn't be so prolific in so many games. The concept is almost never implemented in a way that makes them useful but not overpowered.

Brink seems to be heading in the right direction though, with the smaller maps and less powerful rifles.

Ah, you meant strictly in game.

But you bring up the point that is, to me, the issue. It is not the weapon that makes the kill unseen.

In 95% of games you can snipe a sniper more effectively with an assault rifle, smg, or lmg because there's very little recoil or sway, but the sniper looking through the scope has sway and bounce to contend with, as well as the very limited field of view and usually poor magnification.

The SRs are crappy weapons unless you have the skills with them, but even then those same skills would be far more damaging with most of the other weapons in the game. It's the player that is over powered.

Dude do you snipe? Because you have the mindset of an avid sniper. Most of the snipers I know(including me) think the same way on every point that you stated in any of your posts.

I play whatever way the mood strikes me.

I actually have quite a few mindsets when it comes to gaming, but sniper is one of them when the game is right for it.

Hiya :wavey: I am a sniper.




Yes it does. No sniper class.

Very much so. I am still having a hard time following this argument however, because of the fact that there are still Sniper-class short rifles.
You can still snipe. You just can't be an actual "sniperclass".

I mean I might even use a light rifle as my secondary to ensure my accuracy in between points as a tank.

i played the crap out of BC2 for quite some time, hardly ever saw a wookie running around helping the team, and when they were they had shotguns or one of the universal guns, very rarely to almost never did i see a sniper doing much of anything other just sitting on a rock 3 miles away looking for kills, yeah there are some out there, but its a very small percentage of the gamer pool, and not big enough to need to put snipers in, because the majority of the snipers will just end up being selfish pricks

A sniper rifle exists. There is also an operative class, close to any recon or sniper class in any other game (generally not team orientated and a loner). Also there is a light body type so you can camp random areas.

So all in all, if you feel like being a camping useless player, then the opportunity exists for you in Brink.

Exactly. I can play so many different playstyles. I can snipe, rush, go stealthy, play support etc. It makes the game much more fun and and helps you to choose the tactic that fits the moment

That's why its so vital to find decent people to play with. Pub players are mostly useless. I mean the radar ball is so useful, just trail your squad on the roofs or ridge and have a soldier keep giving you ammo and they can't sneak up on you.




Don't encourage them, heck the best sniping class is easily engineer.

I understand that many of you absolutely despise snipers, but as The Zero stated, snipers are barely snipers... BUT, the problem is buffed snipers. Is this going to turn into a problem? Such as every alleged "sniper" will have it, and not a single one wont?
Buffed snipers could easily turn this into a CoD MW2 or Battlefield BC2-like experience (with all snipers having stopping power and magnum ammo for easier kills) This can represent a significant threat to other snipers and light infantry, where you main concern isnt being headshooted, but just being rapidly spammed by buffed bullets from this "sniper" who is too far away from you to do anything about.

If there are snipers, I guess the damage could go something like this:

Light infantry: Headshots- 100% damage (instant kill)/Torso- 50%/other- 35%
Medium infantry: Headshots- 80% damage/Torso- 45%/other- 30%
Heavy infantry: Headshots- 75% damage/Torso- 35%/other- 20%

As you can see, only one body type (which is the fastest and smallest, thus hardest to hit) would be one hit killed, and even just 2 limb shots would kill him. The medium body type would take significantly less headshot damage, while only taking slightly less limb damage. And finally, heavies would take slightly less headshot damage, but would have a significant reduction on limb damage. This would give diversity to the damage intake of the classes, giving each thier own advantage against snipers, while still having an effective sniper-weapon in the game, right?
I do understand that this would not completely cut off the annoying snipers, because some people are full of themselves, but it would make most of the wanna-be snipers frustrated, and hopefully, make them quit.

And what these people are saying is correct, Brink does need to be different, but we are looking at this the wrong way. We do not need to be different by eliminating the sniper element, but by making one of the first fair snipers the gaming world has ever seen!

--P.S. I am a bit of a sniper, but not a sniper camper. Id enjoy to see snipers in the game, but i think this time around I'll be using a heavy engineer... While sniping, i tend to stand or crouch in a place where you wouldn't notice me unless you were looking for me, i do not hide in spots where you cannot find me. I go for headshots only, and would mind needing a two shot kill headshot on most targets because i understand that sniping is an art of patience. If i couldnt line up a second headshots, i would not care letting the target get away, because generally im covering, or at least attempting to cover, my teamates, who should take care of the last of the work.

Just trust our benevolent overlords as SD to balance this out. Still double buffed light rifle with incendiary rounds. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xR4TZsZOPU.

I disagree: I'm thinking the best sniper would be a weapon-buffed Light Soldier. He'll scramble up to a really high spot in the back of the map with a great view, deal extra damage, and give himself more ammo when needed. Everyone will hate him, but he would probably enjoy himself.

Sort of. He won't get a lot of XP for his efforts, so while we all go completing objectives and leveling up, he'll sit there in the first rank bracket for weeks. How do I figure that? He'd be racking up 10-ish XP per kill, assume 20 kills in a 15 minute game, that's 200 XP a game. We've seen single objectives on the Objective Wheel granting 400 XP instantly. So all the sniper kidlets can stick around in the first rank bracket doing their sniper thing. I'll be playing with more serious players in higher brackets, thank you very much. *pwned*

However, I maintain that players overestimate the openness of the maps. SD wants to keep the combat in Brink "initimate", "close to medium range". They will have built their maps to reflect this: lots of cover, lots of flanking access paths, lots of closed-off, indoor areas. From every indication I have seen, you just aren't going to see a huge space where you can sit on a hill (or a shipping crate or whatever) and blast at bad guys halfway across the level. That just isn't the design of any area we have seen in any map to date. Which, in terms of the game's canon, makes sense: it's a dense urban environment. On the cramped and crowded Ark, long range combat is simply not feasible or remotely effective.

Couple that with the objective-based gameplay (with more XP going toward objectives than kills), and I think players in Brink will lose interest in sniping more quickly than we think. Because it's going to be boring.

Things are more exciting (and fun) in the thick and heat of combat and completing objectives. And dedicated sniper players will just get so mad by the lack of rewards for their efforts and the sheer boredom of not having a lot of targets to pick off (because of all the cover and alternate routes) that they'll quit the game and run back to their "realistic" shooters like COD or Halo or what-have-you. Which is fine; I didn't want them playing this game anyway. *double pwned*

CAN I GET AN AMEN BROTHERS?!

In my humble opinion you are wrong... amen.

Your still thinking of the annoying kind of sniper, being in the back of the map. (Still armed with a buffed bolt action rifle with incendiary ammo that bullet is going to hurt)

Light is the best body type since they can get to other spots that the other bodytypes can't reach.

As I said edge of map isn't going to be that helpful. He should be guarding one of 3 things:

1) An major objective
2) A CP
3) A high volume area of traffic

These are all the places that will see the most action. Now why the Engineer?

1. Weapon buff (the man with the golden gun)
2. Turret to guard your flank or the objective
3. Mines same thing
4. Kevlar armor

With the right location and turrets and mines this character will be quite hard to get to. Other that other snipers and indirect fire. The kevlar armor and a life boost will likely allow him to escape and regroup if attacked by other snipers. He can be resupplied ammo by either the CP or Soldiers (they got to get XP too)

For more useful and effective.

Also as we know, shooting enemies near objectives give you extra XP

No. But you can have a :turtle:. Ive got over 9000 of them.

Anonyway, Wraith showed me a slideshow I had obviously missed and it basically confirms that.
There are, however, some long pathways that enable medium-long range.

Imho, the catwalks that can be seen in the overhead shots allow for cover-sniping, but if you want to camp forget it.
Someone is going to end up behind you.


Edit: Ninja'd twice, but I agree completely with what Wraith has said. Ive had the same discussion before in vent with someone.

I wonder if you have to be near enough or the enemy?



Fixed that for ya.

The mines and turrets and teammates keep the enemies from getting behind. Or just have both.

Touché. Well actually I think THEY have to be close because it makes more sense that if they are near the objective to interrupt the completion of the objective, and you take them out you should be rewarded for that rather than just you being next to it and getting kills on enemies that are nowhere near the objective but still getting extra points.

Engineers can't buff themselves to the maximum (according to the latest video) and we don't know if they can armor themselves; otherwise all your other points do make sense. Until the omnipresent Light Operative comes along and screws everything up by hacking your turret and spotting your mines, and then he disguises as a friendly, comes up behind you, and jacks you up nice and personally with a sticky or something equally startling and lethal. Operative=bane of Engineers' existence.

And my sniper isn't thinking nearly as tactically as yours. Your sniper is a proper adaptation of a sniper to Brink's style of play. Mine is a player from other FPSs just wanting to be an ass and kill people at range for the lulz. Which will more likely represent the population of dedicated snipers than yours. Yours may be (marginally) more successful than mine, but mine will probably be more common upon release (of course, after the disguised Light Operative sniper, who will be a complete failure by all accounts).

I again still hold that sniping will be a far less rewarding playstyle than being in the thick of it all as SD intended.

And the "amen" was on the sniper pwnage. :huh:


Nice. I've actually been on the forums for a while under another name but wanted to change it. Change wasn't enabled so I have to create a new account. But I never got a turtle either, but that probably had more to do the flame-war I immediately got into on joining... :cheat:

Well you won't need the full buff to be worth it, and it will be easier to buff yourself repeatedly over a space of time than seek out someone willing to buff you often enough.

I didn't know the Engi was armor at all, I thought that was the soldier ability.

You're underestimating the "skill sniper" population and overestimating the "lulz sniper" population. The weapons aren't strong enough to appeal to most players. They'll find a different weapon (probably see many go heavy with nade launchers) that they think will have a better effect.

There are features in place to keep the casual snipers from actually picking up a rifle, but for those of us that play the "sniper" in a true tactical sense it is not the rewards we get for playing it that matter, it's the enjoyment that we get from playing it that way, doing our part for the win, and those awesome "hero moments" that the majority of players effected will never even know happened.

Thus why some are passionately participating in this thread. Most of us aren't arguing for better gear, we are arguing against the "hate", stereotyping, and basic prejudice we often face because we play a particular role.

I was just playing BC2. I was never too far away from my team. Whenever they went to plant the bomb I was always in a building close by, keeping people away from the bomb. Won the game pretty quickly.