Snipers were cool in shooters back when only a few people used them and were using them how they were intended. Now in shooters everyone and their mom thinks they're the most bad a** person on the planet and super stealthy and will only ever hide in a remote corner away from alot of action sniping people who aren't near the action either or running around no-scoping. The sniper is a KDR weapon now, its silly.

Plus Brink isn't the type of game to have a sniper anyways. This isn't full out warfare, this is a rebellion and a security. Tell me, do most small rebellions have snipers or everyone on the front line? When was the last time you saw a security guard carrying a sniper? This is frontlines game and it should stay that way.

first i've had a wrong understanding of what sniping is like in brink, i suggested there were no sniper rifles at all.
but the way the guys from SD seem to be doing it right now, with light rifles (= sniper rifles) for every bodytype and class i feel like they are doing the right thing. you wont see many camping snipers because one the one hand side enemies dont fast enough and on the other side you wont level very fast by just caring about a good k/d ratio (which you dont even see in the ranking...) and not completing missions or staying with your team. you also wont see quickscoping because the only target you can 1 shot is a unbuffed light guy hit in the head.

so i guess snipers will be viable and a good sniper can be a game changer, you just have to play him brink-style ...

The teaser trailer. Also the Security is more like a SWAT team then security, and they have snipers.

well, have you EVER seen a rebellious group (maybe ) or a security-/swat-team (dont think so) with a minigun? dont think we have to discuss the degree of reality in brink ^^

Look for a game called Police Quest: SWAT 2.

Police Snipers vs Terrorist Snipers = epic battle.

Then there's clebo's point - Automatic grenade launcher in a riot? Good luck with that "realism" thing you're working on...

EDIT: Looks like my suggested option is already picking up votes... Good to see.

Damn it. I went to bed and look what happened. Now I've got to try to catch up with the thread.



First off, campers and snipers are two different playstyles. The all out "camper" sits in one spot with little view shooting only that which enters his sight, crammed into a corner with no team relative purpose. Snipers set up a position where they are decently defended with a good field of view over their team/objective and use the spot until compromised. Although a camper could be a sniper (by choosing a particular weapon) and a sniper could be a camper, they are not mutually inclusive.

Second, the vast majority of players do nothing but hide or chase a good KDR, although I could argue that in TDM a good KDR is "for the team".



Those feel like conflicting opinions on playstyle, as you don't want them camping but you then compare the game to real war, where camping is not frowned upon at all, because in war KDR really, really matters.

A quickscoper is not a sniper, they are guys using a SR as their weapon and exploiting the mechanics of the game.

Also, I find it amusing that you take a shot at a guy for saying someone else svcks when you have an avatar constantly T-Bagging the forums.




I agree completely except for the "lazy" comment, as sometimes it isn't about being lazy, but simply not being able to provide the needed solution. I've seen very few games where the distance was great enough to make an SR truly "OP" (although Battlefield does an ok job of it) and generally SMGs and LMGs are actually what is OP in their accuracy over range.



Don't blame snipers because the masses thought it was unfair that they couldn't use the SR to begin with. Developers made it easy because that's what the people deemed fair, happens with everything in the name of "balance" and it generally ends up ruining it for somebody.

And actually, yes most small rebelions have far more "sharpshooting" than frontline combat because hunting rifles and the like are generally more available than full on automatic weapons.

Light rifles make plenty of sense from both the Security and Resistance perspectives, as the Resistance probably managed to get much of what they own onboard when they left their homes and even small security forces (they were never just rent-a-guards) have high powered rifles in their modest armories.

But if you want to play that card, we should probably remove most of the grenades and grenade launchers and the miniguns and MGs first.

When did the security turn into SWAT? I thought the security was there as standard security back when celebrities and stuff visited the Ark?

And sure fine, why are there any weapons to begin with on this large boat? Who knows, I for one think it'll be a nice change of pace to have a real frontlines shooter though.

Brink Wikia says they gradually shifted from a basic "hired security" type group into full-on antiterrorism duties as the population problems grew worse. http://brink.wikia.com/wiki/Security.

Also says they get extra water rations - Yay! (seriously, that's a big point for me. I get thirsty REALLY fast. Especially in daytime.

omg someone who also has played SWAT2 i loved that game so much,

I hear that a lot and often wonder if I'm actually plaing the same games as everyone else. I rarely see or get pestered by snipers and usually see an over abundunce of guys running around blasting away and trying to stab each other.

I don't even see that many campers, although there's usually one in every game. It's hardly a world gone mad with them.

As for snipers, the numbers are usually dependant on the game, but in CoD it's only 1 or 2 per team (unless you count ACOG quickscopers, which I do not as they are an assualt class). In MAG you 8 or so per team on the 64 man maps, and in both cases you can kill them at range with most other weapons (except for the really good ones that can get out there really far and snipe).

For the purposes of removing one hit kill guns from the game; yes, those quick scopers would be included.

Not even sure you could ADS that quick but still since it isn't OHI its just a fancy way to get yourself killed.

Well these are light, or long rifles. They are high powered. I don't think they should have slower ADS times.

I never said that. Just quickscoping in Brink will likely fail.

Quick scoping is a mechanic exploit, as long as SD doesn't have zooming in "snap to target" (the flaw introduced in MW2) any attempt is simply a legit attempt at zoomingin and shooting.

And Quickscopers still aren't snipers. It isn't the weapon that makes them snipers, it's how they use the weapon. Quickscopers are similar to a standard infantry class in WW2, except that they exploit the game.

For a sniper to be a bit OP i feel it's natural,the thing that i hate about it is that most ppl go sniping for easy kill/xp,not to contribute to team.

But of course who cares about teamwork.If I kill them all we win yes?You'll enjoy the game/match,no?

Yes, but that's why Brink snipers will be awesome.

Down the wounded enemies, soften up the heavies for your teammates, and all while remaining out of reach. Counter-sniping will probably become viable pretty fast, too.

We'll probably see mediums showing up with LRs as backup weapons... just in case there's a sniper.

And in that respect, Brink still gives players the option to play a sniper role, but has removed the sniper rifle.

Point in case, Quickscopers in Call of Duty are basicly the snipers.
Most maps in the CoD games don't allow sniping anyway.

A sniper's rifle is simply a rifle designed for higher accuracy and fit with a telescopic sight; the Long/Light/SHort Rifle class is a precision tool with attachable scopes. I feel as though people think that this huge aspect isn't going to be present (and there're a lot of people happy about that) except that it is present and I worry how the reaction when people finally see it is going to effect the game.



That's another thing I hear that I don't see. Sure the small maps like Nuketown don't have great room for it, and the spawning system makes it extremely dangerous, but most of the maps have plenty of size for it. MW2 was better for it because you could actually disappear into the tall grass or brush, which you can't do nearly as well in BOP.

Which is why I refused to vote until I got my "I'm still gonna be a sniper" option.

Because you CAN.

And it will be a far less frustrating sniper style than you can have in games which allow snipers to 1-shot anything that moves, but will still allow players to fight from the rear or flank at long range if they know what they're doing.

It will make snipers fun, both to play as and to hunt.

Except it doesn't matter to a large percentage of the anti-sniper crowd because it isn't the weapon that is causing the problem.

"I hate OHKs, that's why snipers svck"
Problem is that in most games with one hit SR HS kills you can put down an opponent with one trigger squeeze from ARs, SMGs, and LMGs just as easily and you don't even need to hit the guy in the head. So why is the sniper's kill such an atrocity?

"Quickscopers svck"
It's an exploitation of a flawed game mechanic, and it's still pretty close to running around with a shotgun that kills in one from close range. It wouldn't even matter in Brink since non-ADS fire is just as accurate as ADS fire.

"I can't see the guy shooting at me, or I can't get to him because he's over there"
That's the problem with "actual snipers" that people express most of the time, but why would I want to let you see me with any weapon? If you can see me then you can shoot me, and I don't want you to shoot me. What is so wrong with me not running out into the open so everybody can see me when I kill you?

A Lightweight low health class with a one shot long range w/scope.. That deals 45% hp a shot. AND is bolt action. (And has to mount their rifle) Thoughts?

That's a little harsh.

Also 45% health on which bodytype?
I think a (sniper) rifle should deal ~95% to a light, 80% to a medium and 70% to a heavy (all unbuffed).

You shouldn't be able to shoot accurate while moving. Mounting the rifle on a wall (standing/crouched; on the ground is no option as there is no prone) would greatly decrease the weapon sway, but isn't available everywhere (obviously).
Having the rifle selected would also disable sprinting/SMART, selecting another weapon would allow it.

You will notice that I, nor many of the people here, nor SD have never said that OHK snipers are inherently unbalanced. What I am claiming, and I can provide SD interviews to back me up on this position, is that OHK sniper rifles make the game less fun for everyone but the ones using them.

The reason that OHKs, especially at a range, are such a buzzkill is that they don't give you a chance to struggle or fight back. With an assault rifle, when you get hit the first time, you have a chance, no matter how small, to try to survive the firefight. When you are killed in one shot, you don't have a chance to get excited or do anything about it, you're just on the ground looking for the reason why.

I can see three immediate problems with your defense of quickscoping. Its an exploit, you said it yourself, it wasnt intended to be in the game. You can get banned from games for abusing exploits, depending on what they are, why is this one so kosher?

There is a major difference between quickscoping and a shotgun, a shotgun cant kill you from across the map. Being able to quickscope removes what is supposed to be the biggest weakness of the sniper rifle, close range shootouts, and turns it into a strength, completely unbalancing the weapon.

Lastly, pointing out that hipfire is accurate in Brink is hurting your argument rather than helping it. If the sniper/long rifles have the close range accuracy penalty removed, should they still have OHK damage? Especially in a game that takes more bullets to kill than most of the other ones out there. If they had a OHK light weapon that was accurate from the hip and out to any range, why would anyone use anything else?

And on your last argument, again, its just not fun to die when you cant fire back. If it is literally impossible for anyone to get a shot on you due to sheer range, there's just no way to have fun. Its not really a flaw on your part to use the most effective strategy you can, but from a developer standpoint, its bad to have impossible situations for the players in the game.

And in all of these respects, it IS the weapon that is causing the problem. In Brink, long rifles will, for the most part, take more than one shot to kill. At the very least, this will give players the chance to struggle to survive before the last of their health is taken away. Long rifles also do a lot more damage to the head. If getting knocked down to 20% health means that someone hit you in the head, its not nearly as annoying as being hit in the toe. Its not the sniping skill-set that ruins fun, just the fact that the weapons are OHK in most games.