Normally id agree with you, but the caesors legion lacks any real area of effects (they do have some better armour and flame throwers [woot] though)

But, in an all out war, everything vs everything. Augmented weapons from the best of the mages, and all the militia the towns can muster, as well as the soldiers that can be contributed by the legion (and the fighters guild) would make a difference. Especially considering caesars legion, EVERYTHING, is military. they can't muster anything more then what they have, besides tearing down their meager shacks to build a palisade.

Id really preffer caesar to win, but in all seriousness, I just don't see how

If it were vs. Enclave, then they'd have no way in hell. Their swords wouldn't cut through PA, their spells would be pretty reflected off of it, it'd be crazy.

alright ive been hearing about how magic beats guns... but lets say CL jacked some mages and used them to make..wait for it.... MAGICAL GUNS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The magic guns would still be a very limited number as enchanted requires soul stones and captured creature souls, and other resources bought with gold that CL would have no access to, especially the enchanting alters.

This is an interesting fight. I'm not sure who would win.

anyone EVER seen a battle mage throw around the custom built magic that the PC has access to (nd is being talked about in this thread)? From what I've seen, battlemages use pretty standard spells, that could be countered just fine by conventional weapons and tactics.

With battlemages the Imperial Legion would win if only for the fact that even legionnaires would run in terror after being blasted with terror inducing destruction spells. Besides given that Caesar's legion is made up of tribals who are more then likely really superstitious and to be blasted at with that of which they don't understand would send many of them into a rout. Not to mention all of the other spells at their disposal and the average machete/spear armed legionnaire would be cut down by the better trained and better equiped Imperial legion soldier.

TES fan/

We don't know what kind of numbers cl has. If the entire il is fighting then we have to assume the entire cl is fighting and they have all of Arizona. Where will this fight take place? If it's in a fallout universe then it's equal if it's in a tes universe it's equal. We need more info but I pick cl. Il is a punch of pansies.

See link for the answer...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/How_many_angels_can_dance_on_the_head_of_a_pin%3F

Imperial Armor might be able to stop a low caliber around, especially if enchanted.

Imperial legion seems to be more regimented than the Legion, and are Much more trained in melee


Lets not forget, Knight Era Heavy-Shields can take a shotgun shell, saw it on TV

And, who is going to stay and fight people who are throwing frickin fireballs out of their fists?



Tribals are religious, and magic would scare the bejesus out of them

Meh. The Imperials would throw an army into the field purely as a distraction, while mages, perhaps aided by some contracted members of the Dark Brotherhood, would infiltrate Caesar's home turf and collapse everything from the inside.

With Dominate, none of your soldiers can be trusted. Good luck curing a magical poison with your antivenom. With Invisibility, no watchman is infallible (unlike a Stealth Boy, an invisibility spell doesn't cost any resources and can be used as often and for as long as you have the energy for it). With Fire magic, you have long range arsonists who can burn down anything from outside your perimeter. With teleportation, one undetectable infiltrator becomes a thousand Imperial troops pouring into your city inside the defenses and with no warning whatsoever. With Damage Health, you have a killer that can strike silently without leaving any evidence that it was even a murder. With Summoning spells, you can call forth horrors that the legion has no weapons against at all.

Caesar's Legion might win a conventional battle, but they sure as hell won't win the war. There's so many ways magic could be used by a special tactics team to utterly demolish Caesar's empire from the inside. The entire command structure would die in the first day of "fighting".

Open Field, would have to go to Imperials with almost complete loss of all men. There are more archers on the IL than gunners in the Legion

CQC, Imperial Victory

Hyper long range goes to Caesar, Arrows just arent sniper rounds

Also, all Imperials are Fully Armored, not so much for Caesar's

CL is gonna need a lot of AP ammo to take down the IL... :blink:

lies. Lanius will just throw his mask at them, instantly crushing them all under its enormous weight and size.

Imperial Legion would win, hands down. They have better armor, training, and they can cast spells. Caesar's are essentially a bunch of tribals in football gear with the occasional low power firearm.

The Imperials could essentially send their Battlemages to the battlefield, have them start casting fireballs, and panic the hell out of Caesar's tribal mindset.

Don't get me wrong; I know that Caesar's aren't as stupid as your average tribal, but still, seeing a bunch of dudes in heavy armor walking about shooting flames from their hands would freak any of those fools out.

Also, why doesn't this have a poll?

No Idea, OP should post a new topic with a poll


Interesting Fact, IRL knight armor can take a Musket shot without being breached



Oh, Wait, Essentials! A few Imperial Legion members are invincible! Gotta love the amount of godmode npcs in that game

Wait, is this battle Caesar invading Cyrodill, or the Imperials invading Caesar's land?

If Caesar invades Cyrodill, he's got no chance, the Imperial Legion respawns!

If the Imperials invade Caesar's land, the odds are better for Caesar, he'll have more forces, the Imperials would get tired walking through the desert in their armour, Caesar's forces could use guerillia tactics, and how would the Imperials reach Caesar's land, Oblivion gate? There may be a victory for Caesar, but with medium-heavy causalities.

The Imperial Mages should have their robes enchanted with Shield, instead of also wearing the heavy armour, it increases spell effiency and if invading Caesar's land, won't get as tired from the desert heat. Unless Shield can't stop bullets.


Also, just to be clear, the Champion of Cyrodill is not helping the Imperial Legion, and the Courier is not helping Caesar's Legion, right?

It doesn't matter what they're up against, command+invisibilty on self means those Enclave Plasma rifles and Heavy Incinerators will become part of the Imperial Legion's arsenal. There is no defense against this. Hell, neither Caesar's Legion nor the Enclave have Detect Life to counter the Invisibilty, they can try using Stealth Boys but it won't get them far.

I say it again, a handful of mages could defeat thousands of regular troops. The Champion of Cyrodil could proably do it single-handedly, if well-specced and properly equipped.

Depends where they're fighting.

While it's almost certain that Battlemages could easily defeat Legionaries in single combat, you have to take into account every other aspect of a war. Battlemages are used to living in Cyrodill, where there are plants and wildlife aplenty to live off of. Transplant them into an irradiated desert wasteland, and suddenly their chances of survival outside of combat look a lot slimmer. They would have a lot more trouble finding food to eat and water to drink. The Legion knows how to survive and scavenge in the wasteland; they've always lived there. Winning the "war" would probably be decided by supply logistics instead of battles.

However, if Caesar decided to invade Cyrodill instead... not sure how that would go. They'd probably be amazed at all of the food and non-radiated water there, though.

Eh, if they sent the IL their, they'd get caravans with food/water from Tamriel, not just Cyrodiil.

Caesar's Legion would win due to their technological advantage. The main hole in your argument regarding armor is that the plate armor that the Imperial Legion uses would have no protective value against a bullet, which Caesar's Legion has plenty of. Sure, the Imperial Legion's armor would likely absorb a blow from a melee weapon like the commonly used machete but would do nothing against a thermal lance (another favorite of Caesar's Legion) or a blunt weapon like a (super) sledgehammer (blunt weapons distribute the force of the blow evenly across the targeted area which would turn any armor the opponent was wearing into a weapon against him itself).

So Caesar's Legion would definitely win.

Depends what weapons CL have: If they have simply Melee weapons then the Imperial Legion will make Caeser PAY THE FINE!. Guns would enslave the Imperial Legion unless they have some of the Mages Guild backing them up.

Someone needs to Mod in Caesers Legion into Oblivion or the Imperial Guard into Fallout to solve this problem.

I'm pretty sure I have seen a Imperial legion soldier survive a direct hit from a Deadroth's Fist, which makes a super sledge seem a bit inept


Bare in mind, Legion uses metal armor of very little thickness (Exempting Legate) which can stop bullets.

And reinforced metal armor, still weaker than IL armor, can stop reasonable caliber rounds

I bet that the bulky and thick Imperial Legion armor could stop a good amount bullets, taking that to consideration



Also, Shields.

The imperial legion has shields, everyone ignores that three to four inch thick slab of metal they use to Protect Themselves

ceazars legion. whatever magic the imperials have is easily countered by technology and then some. ballistic fists, hunting rifles and 10mm and 12.7mm smgs are a bit more than some fire or frost balls. the imperials have battlemages that could theoretically heal except that they expend all their magicka on attack spells right away leaving nothing left over for healing. (im using morrowind magick not the crappy oblivion system). the one thing going for the imperial legion is that apparently caezars troops dont use stimpacks and instead use those utterly useless healing pouches.

the caezars also love those freakin annoying landmine. they got me at checkpoint charlie and also in that mine field and camp forlorn the dirty cheating bastards.

as to the imperial armor blocking bullets..........eh that isnt gonna happen. even archaic muskets go through armor plating and those guns have nothing on modern firearms. dont forget about AP rounds as well.

My point is, there's a massive difference between metal plate or chain armor and weaved fabric armor like a Kevlar bullet resistant vest. A bullet would go straight through plate armor, negating any benefit of wearing it; not to mention that plate armor is heavy and bulky. A Caesar's Legion soldier wears metallic armor plating over fabric armor (resulting in the bullet resistance). If you want proof, just look up any historical article regarding the implementation of firearms on the medieval battlefield and you'll see a massive decrease in the use of plate armor from that point on.

The Imperial Legion's shields would a similar uselessness as protection from firearms. A single Caesar's Legion soldier with a Marksman Carbine would be able to decimate an entire group of Imperial Legion soldiers before they even got within melee distance.