I think a six year old could have fun with this game.

I think an anol experienced rpg player would have to create new and interesting ways to enjoy it because they've been playing these types of games for so long that they get bored with them very quickly.

Oh. Took it the wrong way because you quoted me and then used my name in the next post.

NP. No harm.

Saying that Skyrim is an inferior game is an opinion. It is better in many respects so it depends on how you value the additions and how important are the subtractions to YOU. With but a handful of mods I am mostly satisfied/content. For those for whom the subtractions were very important, won’t be satisfied/content.

Skyrim is an inferior RPG is a FACT, it lacks an astonishing quantity of the RPG elements. We don’t need to even go back in time and compare it to Morrowind we can just compare it FONV where it was evident that a serious attempt was made to increase RPG elements as much as possible instead of just give out the bare minimum.

Agree, Skyrim is a very simple process that doesn't require a lot of thinking, you could almost make the levelup choices blindfolded if you wanted too.

Some people are in denial, apologist mode, or just started the series with Skyrim. TES is NOT what it used to be. I just started a new playthrough in Daggerfall and the character creation puts Skyrim to shame. That is a true RPG. So many more skills, more stats, more ways to define your character, plus the world is much, much bigger and the NPC's have so much more to say.

Correct.

My favorite RPG is Battlefield 3. I'm a veteran soldier who only uses Pistols because his left hand was wounded badly in desert storm.

Saying that you can imagine a game isn't ridiculously shallow and poorly designed doesn't make anything better. They are unrelated; a better game would be enhanced all the more by roleplaying.

Skyrim was poorly designed from the ground up. The lack of consequences or even basic choices, factions and disposition means you're left with an easter egg of a world. It may have a lot on the surface, but is ultimately an empty shell.

I think there are plenty of choices it’s just that they are pointless choices with no consequences.

Are you suggesting meta-gaming to get the most out of an RPG ? Now I've heard it all!

Meta-gaming can go both ways, if you are using information about game mechanics to influence how you progress and play your character then it's still meta-gaming be it if you are using that knowledge to make your character stronger or weaker. And that kind of a mindset goes against anything a good roleplayer believes in when it comes to roleplaying in games.

In both Morrowind and Oblivion I was able to play my characters based on the desires and interests of my own characters and not based on the knowledge of me as a player sitting behind my PC, without breaking the game so easily. In Skyrim it just takes a few levels and you no longer need any upgrades and nothing is a challenge. Not even if you up the difficulty.

And the way of playing you are suggesting seriously limits your options. Like that way no one should be going for a knight or anything that wears any sort of heavy armor.

or this.

I am actually a little surprised how many of you believe that role playing is all about a physical/magical/stealth aspects of your character. I always thought it was more about participating in a vibrant story and having the ability to reshape the story with your actions in a nonlinear way. When you looked past the bug filled mess of Gothic3 I think it did that flawlessly.

I could start the game and go straight for kings stronghold and kill him and the game will adapt to my actions. There was no OMFG he is essential and you just ruined 50 quests. You could choose to conquer towns or destroy rebel strongholds or just ignore the whole situation. The main quest could be completed like 5 diffrent ways and it wasn’t a simple decision towards the end of the game, you had to go on a different quest branch that could span hours.

disregarding simple math and lack of choices. im unsure of your point.

There are many situations where there are obvious choices that just aren't given. Essential NPCs take care of a lot of that; I was extremely upset that I couldn't march up to Ulfric and make him choke on my mace. Same goes for rooting out the corruption within the Companions, destroying the Thieves' Guild with Mjoll, etc.

I agree the main issue is consequences, but the lack of interactivity and choice is close behind.

Just to clarify to some people who seem to believe that I don't admit to any of the flaws in Skyrim...


And to clarify what my position is on the whole "just roleplay it" debate...

i get banned because i love tru rpg's and people that love them, themselves.

The point is that the game, if properly designed, would adapt to player actions. Any experienced RPG player will tell you it's a basic step to plan for the most obvious choices. It's obvious that players will try to kill Ulfric/Tullius. It's obvious that players will want to shut down Maven Blackbriar. There should have been contingencies and alternate quest paths in place.

I like Moon Sugar too??

dumn my fault.

Well, yes on master I can imagine you're having quite a difficult time (being one-shotted by bandits and so forth), but like I said, I find my balance by playing on adept and relying only on my armor, weapons and melee skills. I prefer to leave anything out that deals with magic (unless I'm playing a mage). And BTW, once you hit Lv 20 and up, you'll find steel plate on common bandits and glass weapons at the end of medium-sized dungeons, fortunately, NPCs still have their realistic-quality armor even at higher levels so you won't find common vagrants loafting around in dragon plate. This way, an interesting situation occurs, where even at high levels everyone (including me) is still rocking armor from the beginning of the game. This helps me retain both my sanity and a medieval-yet-slightly-fantasy-like-aka-Tolkienesque view of Skyrim. What I meant by my last comment was that some people won't be able to enjoy Skyrim for the action RPG it is, but maybe they don't want to. One thing however that DOES piss me off about Skyrim is how it really comes through as a game meant for those of us who play CoD...exclusively...and expect a CoD experience even if they aren't playing CoD (or not even a first-person-shooter for that matter). Therefore there are no rules of what you can and can't join. There's no exclusivity. In other words, your muscle-brained, illiterate Nord berserk-er will be accepted as easily into the College of Winterhold as the Companions. Na mean?

PS; I'm not a seasoned RPG player. In fact, Skyrim is my first "pure" RPG (though I've played action-RPGs before) and I'm loving it!

I see the elitists have arrived. *Takes a long, deep breath* Ahhhhhhh you can smell the snob-ism on the wind! Well, nice having you here, now go back to Daggerfall/Morrowind/Arena or wherever you came from.

it doesn't take an elitist to see skyrim's faults.

some, will defend skyrinm forever.

where are you?

+1 for yougivingmelipboy? that made me laugh

And still your observations show that you understand role-playing very well, echoing what people mentioned before, fresh rpg-gamers can understand the idea behind role-playing just as well as old-timers (because role-playing is essentially very easy, it's what you did when you were five and played make-belief with pinecones).

Erhhh Who the hell let the arrogant fanboiz out???

moon sugar:
i thought would have been somewhere an innovation.