[Tammie Flint]

Can we just skip to the part where they come out and say we've tried everything possible and will not be releaseing the DLC.....this gone on for long enough I don't need an other Fallout Three DLC wait.

[CHARLODDE]

Pete Hines has refused to do an interview with IGN about Dawnguard. Apparently, he didn't like the video all that much, but he doesn't want to do an interview to correct any possible mistakes IGN made. This makes me think that Pete was just upset because what IGN said in the video was true.

Here's the video that IGN posed. The 8:50 mark is when they begin discussing Skyrim
http://www.ign.com/videos/2012/09/10/game-scoop-episode-259-part-1

So, I'm going to guess that IGN was right, and Pete Hines doesn't want to go on, because it will only make Bethesda look worse. They refuse to admit they sold an inferior product, and they refuse to admit that they purposely held back review copies of Skyrim because they KNEW it was broken on release. The only possible answer to take from this is that Dawnguard will not be releasing on PS3. Sony is trying to help, but Bethesda messed up big this time.

[Schel[Anne]FTL]

Here's a "What If?" Side Topic:

If Dawnguard never makes it to the PS3 platform (Don't get me wrong, I'm REALLY hoping it does and SOON).

But if it doesn't what are the top 5 features you would want imported from it in a Patch or a "Free" DLC or in a special bundle with the PS3 port of the Hearthfire DLC?

Here's my "Top 5" list:

• Dragon Bone Crafted Weapons
  
  
• Crossbows/Bolts
  
  
• Arrow (and Bolt) Crafting Thanks to Spiritreaver for the suggestion!
  
  
• The "Face Sculptor" in the Ragged Flagon to change your appearance
  
  
• "Upgraded" Werewolf Skill Tree
  
  
• Expanded Alchemy System/Ingredients

I of course would like the "Vampire Lord" skill tree as well and all the other DLC specific items and gear, but it would be sort of out of place without the accompanying "Dawnguard/Vampire" quest line.

360 and PC die hard users would never allow this.

Many of them wanted only one of the features you listed above and were willing to pay 20 dollars specifically for the one feature where the rest was icing on the cake or unwanted.


As for the crossbow and bolts, those are directly tied in to the story and gained through quests, not simply bought where ever you please so, it would be annoying to add actually and probably take a while too for some reason lol.

[Kelly Osbourne Kelly]

Pete Hines has refused to do an interview with IGN about Dawnguard. Apparantly, he didn't like the video all that much, but he doesn't want to do an interview to correct any possible mistakes IGN made. This makes me think that Pete was just upset because what IGN said in the video was true.

Here's the video that IGN posed. The 8:50 mark is when they begin discussing Skyrim
http://www.ign.com/videos/2012/09/10/game-scoop-episode-259-part-1

So, I'm going to guess that IGN was right, and Pete Hines doesn't want to go on, because it will only make Bethesda look worse. They refuse to admit they sold an inferior product, and they refuse to admit that they purposely held back review copies of Skyrim because they KNEW it was broken on release. The only possible answer to take from this is that Dawnguard will not be releasing on PS3. Sony is trying to help, but Bethesda messed up big this time.

Typically to me, a lot of conspiracy theories and bad talk goes out to alot of companies and individuals.

When it becomes suspicious is when they directly deny or do everything they can to remove a video, then it starts to seem like truth, since everyone else knowing what's a lie just stays quiet and lets people vent.

When they attack the "conspiracy" it grabs more attention too, making more people aware of it.



So since he just attacked the "conspiracy" and is refusing to give any facts to oppose said "conspiracy", it is probably true.

And he wasn't smart enough to keep quiet and let it die down on its own lol

[Chantel Hopkin]

Been a few threads since I've returned to post anything, so just adding some thoughts to the whole situation..
On one hand I care because I still check the forums. I won't be a liar and state otherwise. On the other hand I am working on volume one of The Slayers (based on the anime) and I thoroughly enjoy doing my own scripting and game creation, along with trying to keep it as lore-friendly and true to the series as possible (unfortunately the U.S. never got The Slayers game for any system ). This has kept me busy and receiving calls from my friends who are fans asking when it's going to be done.

On subject, if I had yet a third hand, I would say I'm unconcerned with this whole mess. I stand my ground in stating that if Bethesda knew about their inability to adequately port to PS3 they never should have done so in the first place. I would have been fine with sheer honesty. Of course, this is counter-intuitive to a business that will lose out big to an audience. However, hindsight may prove to be a bigger lesson as folks may walk away forever. I've stated before I'm a die-hard TES fan. I've also stated I would always buy and love their games. One thing to remember about statements and loyalty: they do and can change. One day a studio will outdo Bethesda in terms of open-world RPG's, customer communication, and sheer joy of lore in their "world". I have no qualms about puling my plug and filling my time with other endeavors, like creating my own game series. This goes beyond DG, yet also addresses it.

Oddly, I shouldn't be complaining. My copy of Skyrim has run (near)perfect since launch on 11/11/11. My argument is for all PS3 users and the integrity of a studio to admit they shouldn't have released a game that would essentially go thusly: "it'll work for some people and won't run at all for others. Ah, what the hell; just release it and get the money. We'll deal with it later". This is what's happened. This is truth.

My one cent (I spent the other on penny-candy ).

[Tanya Parra]

Can we just skip to the part where they come out and say we've tried everything possible and will not be releaseing the DLC.....this gone on for long enough I don't need an other Fallout Three DLC wait.

Nope, two reasones.

#1 - They would piss off the rest of the PS3 fans and not be able to rake in the money from hearthfire, horsearmor and so on.. We know beth is going to do just enough to keep svcking the cash in from the PS3 community.

#2 - I think they will release DG on a Skyrim GOTY edition in a year or two then they can say "See we have been working hard all this time."

It will be utterly and completely broken, just like FONV:UE, but they will garner some more cash. There will be some outrage, of course, but just like FONV:UE isn't getting attention Skyrim will be old news and the Skryim:PS3 forum will just look like the FONV:PS3 forum does now - pissed off customers and zero answers or support from the likes of GStaff and co..

[carla]

I have to ask, doesn't this break Trading Standard Laws in the US? Aren't they possibly criminally liable?

Yes. If there is the possibility of anyone picking this up they have pretty well broken consumer laws in most developed countries. They have sold a product not fit for its intended purpose. I know for a fact that a product must be safe and fit for its intended purpose. Any legal jargon companies put around that is still going to be subject to that. And that the studio director, Todd Howard, already admitted they sold it knowing it was not fit could make them criminally liable.

Interesting, this will probably be the only way to get a refund, IF Bethesda decides to finally own up to no further updates, fixes, and DLC (that would be falsely advertised in this case) for the PS3. I will continue to monitor accordingly and pray to The Nine it doesn't come to this.

[Gracie Dugdale]

Nope, two reasones.

#1 - They would piss off the rest of the PS3 fans and not be able to rake in the money from hearthfire, horsearmor and so on.. We know beth is going to do just enough to keep svcking the cash in from the PS3 community.

#2 - I think they will release DG on a Skyrim GOTY edition in a year or two then they can say "See we have been working hard all this time."

It will be utterly and completely broken, just like FONV:UE, but they will garner some more cash. There will be some outrage, of course, but just like FONV:UE isn't getting attention Skyrim will be old news and the Skryim:PS3 forum will just look like the FONV:PS3 forum does now - pissed off customers and zero answers or support from the likes of GStaff and co..

damn @_@, meh doesn't matter to me anymore, I've got both AC3 and Liberation on preorder as well BLOPS2, plus plently of other games I still haven't beat, I sold that broken mess of a game.....hell...skyrim runs way better then FO:NV did in my experience....

[Rachie Stout]

Interesting, this will probably be the only way to get a refund, IF Bethesda decides to finally own up to no further updates, fixes, and DLC (that would be falsely advertised in this case) for the PS3. I will continue to monitor accordingly and pray to The Nine it doesn't come to this.

Personally I think it wouldn't happen (official lawsuit, that is). Think of the floodgates being open to interpretation.. ANY game released with ANY bugs could be targetted for lawsuit and I don't think it could realistically be pursued. There is no "lemon law" for video games, and remember the RROD for the Xbox: folks could get their systems fixed, and Bethesda is releasing patches showing continual work.

[lolly13]

Personally I think it wouldn't happen (official lawsuit, that is). Think of the floodgates being open to interpretation.. ANY game released with ANY bugs could be targetted for lawsuit and I don't think it could realistically be pursued. There is no "lemon law" for video games, and remember the RROD for the Xbox: folks could get their systems fixed, and Bethesda is releasing patches showing continual work.

But there could definitely be a lawsuit for false advertisemant, as they did advertise that DG would be available for PS3

[Jah Allen]

Nope, two reasones.

#1 - They would piss off the rest of the PS3 fans and not be able to rake in the money from hearthfire, horsearmor and so on.. We know beth is going to do just enough to keep svcking the cash in from the PS3 community.

#2 - I think they will release DG on a Skyrim GOTY edition in a year or two then they can say "See we have been working hard all this time."

It will be utterly and completely broken, just like FONV:UE, but they will garner some more cash. There will be some outrage, of course, but just like FONV:UE isn't getting attention Skyrim will be old news and the Skryim:PS3 forum will just look like the FONV:PS3 forum does now - pissed off customers and zero answers or support from the likes of GStaff and co..

but uhh... what cash?

They need to release more products for PS3 fans to buy, unless you're referring to dishonored.

I mean, I sold my PS3 copy

[AnDres MeZa]

If anything, we'd just get a little money for Dawnguard not being released. After the lawyer/lawyers get payed, we'd end up getting like MAYBE 5 bucks.

[Naazhe Perezz]

If you think about the way a transaction is handled, things become more problematic. For example; if you are at a restaurant and order a steak and get liver and tell them you ordered the steak, you get your steak or money back with an apology. If you eat the liver first and then complain, they ask "if you didn't want it then why did you eat it?!". This presents a problem. When Skyrim released, there was no way to tell if you were getting "steak" or "liver". We bought the game and through chance folks got one or the other. Essentially we've all "eaten" one or the other. What SHOULD have happened is a beta for PS3. A dozen people playtesting for hundreds of hours is far less a work horse than 10 million people playing for a few hours to detect critical errors and stability in the game. They did this for DG with Xbox (although there are still Xbox players that say DG is unplayable).

Possibly a lesson learned too late. Thoughts, Gstaff? I know you're out there somewhere..

[Fam Mughal]

If you think about the way a transaction is handled, things become more problematic. For example; if you are at a restaurant and order a steak and get liver and tell them you ordered the steak, you get your steak or money back with an apology. If you eat the liver first and then complain, they ask "if you didn't want it then why did you eat it?!". This presents a problem. When Skyrim released, there was no way to tell if you were getting "steak" or "liver". We bought the game and through chance folks got one or the other. Essentially we've all "eaten" one or the other. What SHOULD have happened is a beta for PS3. A dozen people playtesting for hundreds of hours is far less a work horse than 10 million people playing for hundreds of hours. They did this for DG with Xbox.

Possibly a lesson learned too late. Thoughts, Gstaff? I know you're out there somewhere..

PS3 never got a beta and 360's beta was just a stunt to bring in more hype.

But yeah, you don't really know how bad the PS3 version is bugged till you spend some time on it. And the hype of it dies lol

[chloe hampson]

but uhh... what cash?

They need to release more products for PS3 fans to buy, unless you're referring to dishonored.

I mean, I sold my PS3 copy

I think they will release smaller DLCs on PS3. If they flat out say 'No DG for PS3' then a lot more people are going to just flip them the bird and pass on all those.

If nothing else it would make any contractual obligations, warranties written or implied so to speak, be more defensible. It would make any civil complaints more difficult and probably stave off any real consequences outside of having alienated a large portion of the gaming industry.

To be clear, I'm not saying I think anything will ever come from their malicious intentions. They have too much money and sadly in the US that will win them any cases..

However, I do think they could be taken to task in some of the smaller EU countries. European courts have a better track record of challenging companies that operate with shoddy business practices.

[Victor Oropeza]

If DG ever comes to PS3 I've lost so much interest I have no intention of buying it. I have no interest in HF as the thought of raising orphans and building a house just makes me simply watch my kids play Harvest Moon, or watch someone play The Sims. Of course I'm here posting on the DG release thread so my vested interest has become more about what Bethesda will or won't admit to the fiasco. The thing that keeps creeping into my mind is the seen at E3 with Todd Howard explaining DG and basically pointing out how cool it was (vampire lord, dragon weapons, etc), and how Xbox will get it.. yadda, yadda, yadda. When asked by Morgan Webb about other platforms it was a drawn out "I have.... No idea". The pitch was for Xbox and that's that. I no longer really care and will most likely keep a keen eye out for an up-and-rising studio that will beat Bethesda on all fronts. It will happen. There's always someone more ambitious, more open to customers, and have a more killer universe to create. One thing pops always told me "Son, there's always someone bigger and better". A humbling lesson, but one that makes you understand the nature of all things, including games.

[Darrell Fawcett]

I think they will release smaller DLCs on PS3. If they flat out say 'No DG for PS3' then a lot more people are going to just flip them the bird and pass on all those.

If nothing else it would make any contractual obligations, warranties written or implied so to speak, be more defensible. It would make any civil complaints more difficult and probably stave off any real consequences outside of having alienated a large portion of the gaming industry.

To be clear, I'm not saying I think anything will ever come from their malicious intentions. They have too much money and sadly in the US that will win them any cases..

However, I do think they could be taken to task in some of the smaller EU countries. European courts have a better track record of challenging companies that operate with shoddy business practices.

But there's fear hearthfire, a small DLC, will do much worse on the PS3 seeing as to how memory is the issue and HF is nothing but memory. Creating new houses, opportunities random events, random items and so on and so forth.

And adding more cheese wheels!!! xD

But uh yeah, I think Beth is kind of done with PS3 and skyrim lol.

Unless Sony can find the root of the issues that is.

If DG ever comes to PS3 I've lost so much interest I have no intention of buying it. I have no interest in HF as the thought of raising orphans and building a house just makes me simply watch my kids play Harvest Moon, or watch someone play The Sims. Of course I'm here posting on the DG release thread so my vested interest has become more about what Bethesda will or won't admit to the fiasco. The thing that keeps creeping into my mind is the seen at E3 with Todd Howard explaining DG and basically pointing out how cool it was (vampire lord, dragon weapons, etc), and how Xbox will get it.. yadda, yadda, yadda. When asked by Morgan Webb about other platforms it was a drawn out "I have.... No idea". The pitch was for Xbox and that's that. I no longer really care and will most likely keep a keen eye out for an up-and-rising studio that will beat Bethesda on all fronts. It will happen. There's always someone more ambitious, more open to customers, and have a more killer universe to create. One thing pops always told me "Son, there's always someone bigger and better". A humbling lesson, but one that makes you understand the nature of all things, including games.

DG isn't all it's hyped up to be, just like how skyrim can be great but isn't revolutionizing without all the hype.

The hype makes dawnguard, not necessarily the content itself.


Oooh VL, all hype. Drop the hype and for many VL form won't be interesting.
You get more complaints about DG now actually.

in the beginning it was all praise, but now a decent amount of complaints have started to surface. People played both sides, experienced it, and realized things they really didn't like about the DLC.

You still have many defending it but I still believe it's all hype, and pardon my wording but "really devoted fan" like tendencies. I hate the word really devoted fan because it's typically negative but here I just mean an obsessive kind of thing, not an insult but just die hard fans that are willing to take anything given to them.


MANY people have literally stated that no matter how bad a game is, if it is Bethesda they will ALWAYS buy it.

That's what I mean by really devoted fan. They don't even care about the quality, they just want the name slapped on it and it's perfect.




On a side note when I typed this I had the image of a sandbox game where you play as a stick man, then I started wondering if there's a mod that replaces all characters in the game with stick figures. That'd be fun xD

[Vickey Martinez]

I think there's still an online flash game called KoL (Kingdom of Loathing) that does the stick-figure thing. It's not open-world but super funny and kind of interesting. I played years ago and get this.. the currency isn't gold or anything. It's "meat"

[Ezekiel Macallister]

Here's a "What If?" Side Topic:

If Dawnguard never makes it to the PS3 platform (Don't get me wrong, I'm REALLY hoping it does and SOON).

But if it doesn't what are the top 5 features you would want imported from it in a Patch or a "Free" DLC or in a special bundle with the PS3 port of the Hearthfire DLC?

Here's my "Top 5" list:

• Dragon Bone Crafted Weapons
  
• Crossbows/Bolts
  
• Arrow (and Bolt) Crafting Thanks to Spiritreaver for the suggestion!
  
• The "Face Sculptor" in the Ragged Flagon to change your appearance
  
• "Upgraded" Werewolf Skill Tree
  
• Expanded Alchemy System/Ingredients

I of course would like the "Vampire Lord" skill tree as well and all the other DLC specific items and gear, but it would be sort of out of place without the accompanying "Dawnguard/Vampire" quest line.

Those all are magnificent suggestions... I would have almost all of that...
Possibly something like this.
1. Dragon Weapons and craftability
2. Armor: Bracers for all armors and craftable
3. Armor: Horned Helmets for all armors and craftable
4. Werewolf skill tree
5. Character reimage (The Face Sculptor in Ragged Flaggon)
6. Character respec
7. Craftable arrows
8. Crossbows and bolts (craftable)
9. Adoptions
10. Houses buy able of land buy able in all 9 strongholds and redecorate house or build and decorate
11. Spouse can live in any place with u and will walk around the community too no matter the city

This list is starting with 1 assuming that would be the easiest to code or put in the game and 11 wud be most difficult to put in... As well as what i believe to be stuff that shud have been in the game from the beginning to extra stuff... So Bethesda cud just start with easy stuff and as it gets harder maybe dont do it if can't get it to work

[Danel]

On a side note, that's also why I decided to "kick it old school" and do an RPG on The Slayers. Graphics are nice and all, but sacrificing story or game stability is rather poor choice making. To be completely honest, I still rate FF6 as my all-time favorite RPG. The story was amazing, the characters made you really connect with them, and (to me; I don't know about any others) Kefka was the only villian EVER to successfully destroy the world and become a god. I would sell my PS3, all my TES games, renounce Bethesda forever, and eat yellow snow to have a remake of FF6 (like they did for FF4 on the DS).

DG be damned. HF can fly a kite

[Peetay]

On a side note, that's also why I decided to "kick it old school" and do an RPG on The Slayers. Graphics are nice and all, but sacrificing story or game stability is rather poor choice making. To be completely honest, I still rate FF6 as my all-time favorite RPG. The story was amazing, the characters made you really connect with them, and (to me; I don't know about any others) Kefka was the only villian EVER to successfully destroy the world and become a god. I would sell my PS3, all my TES games, renounce Bethesda forever, and eat yellow snow to have a remake of FF6 (like they did for FF4 on the DS).

DG be damned. HF can fly a kite

How about a remake of FF6 with PS3 Graphics?

I agree FF^ set the standard for RPGS nothing compares to it or FF& or even Chrono trigger. 3 of the greates games ever!!! No game today can mess with your emotions the way these games did.

[Cameron Wood]

How about a remake of FF6 with PS3 Graphics?

I agree FF^ set the standard for RPGS nothing compares to it or FF& or even Chrono trigger. 3 of the greates games ever!!! No game today can mess with your emotions the way these games did.

The thing with FF6 was the entire package. The music. The characters. The sense of devotion and investment to the story. The urgency of the situation. Sure, it wasn't true open-world, but I'd take a FF6 remake over anything Bethesda could ever do. That being said, I'd LOVE a PS3 remake. Although, my research has shown there might be a remake for 3DS. If this happens, just.. wow. I would happily buy a 3DS and kiss Bethesda goodbye. By the time I'd played through the game 100 times another company will have come along and trumped Bethesda. Yes, I know this is a DG forum, so to keep it on topic somewhat: My sights are on bigger fish right now. Don't care too much anymore. I have my own project and games that still need completing. I am only still here to see what folks think overall and wasting time 'till I get the kids from school. Besides I need a break from scripting my game .

Edit: as a side note, from what I understand it's more than a whisper about a FF6 remake for 3DS. I am making it a point NOT to purchase anything Bethesda related and seeing what comes from this. I will purchase that any day, along with the system. My DS games will not go to waste on the new platform, so I wouldn't have any reservations buying a new system for a game I've cherished since it came out (and I was in high school then. I'm 35 now!). If I want vampire action I'm simply going to reinstall Bloodlines on my PC and play it the way I grew up with: using the White Wolf system. Bethesda can take a hike,

[Jason Wolf]

But there's fear hearthfire, a small DLC, will do much worse on the PS3 seeing as to how memory is the issue and HF is nothing but memory. Creating new houses, opportunities random events, random items and so on and so forth.

That really svcks because I'm with the other guy that Hearthfire seems more interesting to me than Dawnguard. I wouldn't mind the vanilla game with the ability to build my own house and be an even stronger financial powerhouse with my own HQ. I would love to have both honestly, but that doesn't seem possible.

And adding more cheese wheels!!! xD

But uh yeah, I think Beth is kind of done with PS3 and skyrim lol.

Unless Sony can find the root of the issues that is.

Bethesda: "Hey, we got this game ready for sale on your platform. Play for it about 5 hours and tell us what you think!"
Sony: "Looks decent, plays nice, we're going to sell it. Let us know when you've shipped it out."

(months later, a day before launch)

Bethesda: "Hey by the way, the game we made is going to have quite a few problems down the line and we're not sure if we can fix them all, but we've shipped them out to stores and it's ready to sell tomorrow."
Sony: "Wait, I thought you said this game was ready and now you're telling us there is going to be major problems for our community? I'm not so sure we want this to go on sale for our platform."
Bethesda: "No Givesies Backsies!" No worries though, we'll fix it all with a couple of patches and your players will be happy.

(10 months later....)

Bethesda: "So hey Sony, we've had some problems with the PS3 version of Skyrim and we're not sure what to do. Can you help us?
Sony: "Sure we can. We want to please our community as much as possible and let them know what is going on"
Bethesda: "Yeeeehhhh, you see we don't want to let them in on anything just yet because we're not sure we can fix this. Your machine is giving us fits"
Sony: "Wait, if it's our machine that is giving you fits, why didn't you ask for our help to begin with??"
Bethesda: "Yeeeehhhh, we thought nobody would notice that the product doesn't work that well. Figured they would just think it's them and they would keep making new characters instead of finishing the game.
Sony: "Ok, so what do we need to fix?"
Bethesda: "Well, is there any way to change the PS3 so it can be more like an XBox? It works pretty well on that setup."
Sony: "Wow, that's not possible. You would think that you would have figured that out since we have more working consoles out there than those guys"
Bethesda: "So is that a yes or a no?"
Sony: "No, we can't change the hardware.
Bethesda: "Damn, that was our only idea. We should have thought of this years ago...."
Sony: "Yeeeehhhhhh......"

[Ben sutton]

if its the ram holding Skyrim back on the PS3 then just use a feature like readyboost and allow us to use a thumb drive as extra ram likw on Windows Vista and WIndows 7 HAHAHA

[mishionary]

@ DarksunTheFirst

Lol haha *claps* nice one mate.