So tell me then that the first 20 levels wern't full of getting 'owned' by creatures like Falmer then? I don't believe it, I have made a few charachters and even on my 'Tanks' it takes awhile to get your skills up enough for the tougher creatures.

I know, but the point is we shouldnt have to glitch up mountains.
We used to have acrobatics, jumping spells and levitation.
That a feature so advanced, liberating and fun is removed in order to 'guide us through the world better' is just shameful.
It really removes from the 'open world' feel and limits freedom.

I think I'm the fattest hater here. Is there an award for that? There better be, I want an award too!


Failing that, I'll definitely win the hater award for the most uses of the vault boy smilies!

God this is sad, its a game and everyone has their right to like or dislike the game. What is wrong with people and their devoted fan mentality?

What? Are you telling me that Les Moonves is more interested in making money than settling down with Julie and bashing orcs??!?! Unpossible!

I'm still here. I'm still critical. I won't go anywhere until a proper TES game is made.

You know, I really want to side with you here. I am with you... I am a bit taken aback by the word you used to describe the game , though.

Yeah, It is linear. I agree with everything you have posted. And, I do understand that the game is "svcky" in your eyes.

I am pretty sure you probably don't play it then? Just wonderin'

And there aint' nutn' wrong with that......fine.

There is a horse you can buy that climbs the mountains....

Yes, the jumping mechanic is hurtn'

Yes, all of the magic elements you have stated really do hurt.

And, thanks to that Morrowind Extended mod that got released, I'm playing that as well as Skyrim, Oblivion, Daggerfall......everything.

And, yeah the series is not changing to our liking.....agree.

i didnt have any problems at low levels, i didnt get "owned" all of the time. take your /fail logic elsewhere

I never really felt it was a glitch personally, but I do agree that the loss of skills that enhanced that style is sorely missed.
I would say a better statement for the linear feel is having too many quests with just one solution shoved down our throats. I was really upset about some of those.

Edit: grammar fail

For some reason I know what all the words in your post mean, but I am unable to gleam any meaning from the actual sentences.
Who is Les Moonves? Why would he settle down with Judy? Who is Judy?

Oh well, Ill blame my not being English for this one.

Edit, to Penumbras:
Ive played the game through with three characters and Im done now.
That in itself is baffling, being done with a TES game. But there is just nothing more to see, nothing more to figure out, no-one interesting to talk to and character creation is so gimped that I cant even make a viable new original character anymore.

For starters, Spell Making isn't all it was cracked up to be, I would often get bored and just buy pre-made spells anyhow, then there is the way spells are displayed in the world now, you can't tell me the spells and effects in Skyrim don't look fantastic especially compared to the previous TES games!

In regards to freedom it is still there, I don't feel jumping around or levitation anything that would make me turn my game on, you can still go 'anywhere' you can still do 'anything' you like, unlike some other games I can mention.

The mountains... well I used to hate running around trying to find a route up, if I wanted to go mountain climbing I would go get my Spike Boots on and do it in RL, if you consider jumping around like a fool trying to get higher fun then kudo's to you, I like the fact that there is normally one main way up because you know people have made the tracks because they have been there before, its shocking I know!

Admit it you hated Skyrim even BEFORE it was released, my argument still stands that you were NEVER going to like Skyrim and you haven't even given it a chance!

It's okay to dislike a game...but when people whine and gripe about the same thing over and over and over and over and over......
And some of the comlaints are just plain stupid and have no merit.

Like me going into a beer forum and posting over and over again that I don't like Bud Lite. Nobody gives a f$@% and people would tell me to SHUT UP after a while.

So...talking about bugs is one thing.
Whining because they took away levitation or changed character development, and crying because acrobatics is gone...well....SHUT UP already.

fail logic lol Your very mature, I bet you do, and thats why you hate the game, you find it too hard to powergame through and are spending most of your time crying. Alas it hurts.

Spell creation definitely was all it was cracked up to be, but was depended on how creative you could be. Effects and gameplay>graphics and 'purdy' animations.

Which is the point I made, you can only see so many of the same threads before you start to get annoyed, meanwhile everyone who loves the game is too busy playing to even bother coming here to the circus!

And how about story/quest depth within Skyrim? is that a "serious" issue or just move along?

Various things BGS implemented in their game has been severely downsized or hasn't reached anywhere near to its potential that it could be.

To address the OP: no, thank god.


Having people hate the game constructively is good for everyone.

I rarely agree with people like Merari or Erandur, but without them no progress would be made in the game. We would end up with titles that had little to no evolution.

Doesn't mean I wont argue with the more extreme people, but that is expected of moderates on both sides of the argument.

Given how fast pace the fights can be the ability to I dunno have an acrobatics skill to give your light armored player a tangible bonus over enemies that may not be as nimble seems a darned good reason to have the skill in the game. I mean, watch any Hollywood fight scene that isn't about brawling and you will see combatants use the terrain to their advantage, even if it means jumping on something to get to an advantageous position. I did it in Oblivion all the time. It's not about jumping for the sake of jumping, it's part of who your character is. Or at least, you have the option to make it that way. Granted, you ALSO have the option to make it just a means to an end on leveling if you so choose. But why did they need to eliminate that possibility?

I was incredibly critical before release, because I saw a lot of this malarky coming a mile off.
Only no-one would listen to me ranting about the loss of spellmaking, they were all 'glyphs are cool'.
And I must admit, Skyrim looks amazing. It is beautiful. I can just stare up at the night sky for minutes at a time, enjoying myself.
This is one aspect that I have no negative critique on, Skyrim is beautiful.
Unfortunately, that is all it is.
The best icing in the world does not make a good cake out of a stale brick.

I did give Skyrim an honest chance though, I do not think it is fair to say that I never wanted to like it.
I tried really hard to like it, in fact. I wanted to love it, I wanted a worthy sequel to Daggerfall and Morrowind.
I tried really hard to get that TES feeling back, but its just gone. Replaced by cardboard generics.

jpo, your support of the current skyrim also puzzles me. As for role playing, I've thousands of hours in Morrowind and Oblivion. There are three roles in Skyrim. The races and sixes are generic and do not matter- that is cosmetic. Racial disintions are gone. Everyone treats you as a Nord regardless. The character growth is shallow and boring. These games rely upon character building- Skyrim's has been truncated. The interaction with NPC's has been truncated. If you've hundreds of hours in Morrowind and Oblivion and and have hundreds in skyrim and still like it better, more power to you. If that's the case we'll soon see if there are more customers who match your needs or enough like mine to matter.

I've said all along that Bethesda may have known there were more people who would like the current Skyrim than not. I don't believe those people are ones I would like as well as those who value character building and role playing. That's just my personal opinion. If you read the posts, I don't believe most of the Skyrim boosters are as thoughtful as the disent. But the world wrestling federation puts IQ in its proper place. Lest that seem like an awful smear, there is something to be said for mindless zombie killing, ofr instance, or a person who does not think the character building in Oblivion was worth their having to think about it in order to play a game. That's not IQ- which is over rated, that may just be people. People wanted an easier time of it.

some of these games do go too far- the leveling is complex with mathematical formulas to calculate your damage; I remember Sacred. But the Elder Scrolls were a happy balance between a kind of nerd obsession and a need to relax and have fun and be entertained. Now that has gone. What is left is not a role playing game in the classic tradition but a action adventure with some role playing characteristics. I like the Elder Scrolls as RPG.

Take care

Haha its funny how everything in the past seems that much better isn't it? Like how you look back at High-School and say to yourself ' Ahhh that was a blast' whereas in reality it really wasn't! If you went back and played Morrowind now you would be quite dissapointed, I alas did that just before Skyrim was released, apart from the svcky animations, crappy graphics, and lifeless NPC's that just stand around doing nothing with no routines, there there are those @^@^! flying fricken lizards.... don't get me started on them! For every reason you can say Morrowind is better I can counter with something that wasn't, its like comparing Apples to Oranges, everyone has their opinion but yours doesn't make it 'Fact'!

I'm still here, not going anywhere. and Just because I critisize Skyrim doesn't mean thats my reason for being here. and if thats what people think, "The folks honestly have nothing better to do than to bash on a game they don't like" then I cannot find the words appropriate for description.

Some peeps who Critisize still like the game, and they speak because they want change, you know that common phrase that was thrown around at "haters" before Skyrims release? "they are afraid of change" yeah ain't much changing now is there. the sooner peeps realize this the better I think.


and this thread isn't even about Skyrim but the people playing Skyrim. can we talk more Skyrim? atleast the "critisicm" threads Talk about Skyrim

Give me Skyrim's beauty with Daggerfall's character builder and Morrowind's depth and we can all go home happy.

Still here. Still like the game. Still find planty to critisize. Ever notice that nothing is perfect?

I was creating spells yesterday, playing Morrowind last week, no nostalgia required. Not that tired fallacy again. It was better then because it is just overall better, period.