[Irmacuba]

True, but I still think they are pushing the tolerances for what the gaming community will stand for without effects in the future.

You would be amazed what people will swallow. There's a reason I don't collect airmiles (or 'avios'). "O hai, we're having a change of name, which means we'll also be chopping the value of your savings in half k thx bai".

By all means, vote with your wallet, but IMO all that's gone amiss with this particular instance is some prat in a suit behind the scenes got jumpy and gagged everyone in terms of giving out anything that wasn't 100% concrete. That's my interpretation anyway, with what knowledge I possess of the big business machine...

[Miss K]

My irritation with this issue comes solely and completely from the lack of upfront, honest information regarding it. The trouble is, where is that coming from? I think its executive meddling.

[Jamie Lee]

Am I the only one who just can't see how Microsoft could have made any profit from the deal? I haven't heard of ANYONE who'd made a switch to the Xbox because of the DLC.

[Mr.Broom30]

Lack of humour to realise I am in fact having a dig at your constant rolling around shouting INVALIDATE INVALIDATE like a Dalek at every post.
At the end of the day, like my post stated, it has so far been a piss poor excercise in Public Relations. I am sure you understand that, or like you yourself asked of someone earlier in these forums. Is English your first language?

So I ask you, is there any valid reason as to why when the 30 days were up and all the uproar started none of the below phrases could have been said?
a. Sorry folks, xbox guys only.
b. Sorry folks, bit of hassle during development but we are on it. We will keep you posted.
c. Sorry guys, going to be exclusive a bit longer but we still plan to slide it your way at a later date.

The ones I feel sorry for are the mods having to sort all this mess out.

*facepalm*

Well that took a turn for the worst real fast, didn't it. What happened to being civil and mature?

I was prepared to let you have the last word, but really? Resorting to Ad Hominem because someone doesn't agree with you? Is that what this has come to? Get off your high horse and grow up. Also, i've said the word "invalid" about twice during my entire time on this forum (which you matched in that single comment, hey ho), it's not because I lack humour, it's because you are not funny; stop trying. In your opinion the PR was bad, in my opinion it was not - and because I don't share your view, that means English is not my first language? What kind of warped, childlike and backward logic is that? I questioned whether that person's first language was English because he had bad English and misunderstood the patch notes, not because he didn't share my opinions, so nice try.

Pete Hines has already said on Twitter that info will be coming this very week regarding DG, and Gstaff has said that the PS3 and Xbox 360's 1.7 patch is being submitted this week if all goes to plan. The 1.7 patch itself confirms without a shadow of a doubt that DG is coming to PSN and Steam (as it fixes Dawnguard issues for all platforms not just Xbox 360, even the 1.6 patch on the PC had Dawnguard files in it), and the Steam CDR database provides yet more evidence of DG's inevitable arrival on other platforms. For the sake of the argument; let's pretend all of the above information didn't exist, and that we were actually left in the dark here; why on Earth would they have the 30 days of exclusivity if they were not planning to release it on other platforms? Are you seriously telling me that you couldn't put 2 and 2 together here?

The ones I feel sorry for are the mods having to sort all this mess out.

So much irony.

[Dan Endacott]

Am I the only one who just can't see how Microsoft could have made any profit from the deal? I haven't heard of ANYONE who'd made a switch to the Xbox because of the DLC.

It's not a move made for financial gain, it's one made for Market share. For every impatient individual who bought an xbox for DG (and it does actually sadden me that some people reportedly did so), they will have uttered 'winning'.

Looking at it from the cold hard perspective of business, the best thing to do in a recession is go after Market share as opposed to profit, especially if your profits are as astronomically comfortable as MS's.

[joannARRGH]

Am I the only one who just can't see how Microsoft could have made any profit from the deal? I haven't heard of ANYONE who'd made a switch to the Xbox because of the DLC.

some rich kids probably cried his parents ears off for one and if this delay last any longer some other kids will do aswell

1MS buys 30 days exclusive rights for their xbox
2 kiddies with their Xbox have lotsa fun
3 MS convinces/bribe /blackmails beth into delaying launch otherplatforms
4 ?????
5 Profit

[Vickey Martinez]

I was gonna say, getting Pete to say the "probably by the end of the week" was probably you people forcing him to cave in as much as you will ever get him to. Technically speaking, he probably shouldn't say that, it's most likely against PR policy to say anything when there's a good chance it might not turn out true.

Dawnguard is coming, a lot of its functions are now installed on the PC version of the game, and the patch which does so is being sent to the PS3.

Why would they add Vampire's Grip without Dawnguard?

[Suzy Santana]

I was gonna say, getting Pete to say the "probably by the end of the week" was probably you people forcing him to cave in as much as you will ever get him to. Technically speaking, he probably shouldn't say that, it's most likely against PR policy to say anything when there's a good chance it might not turn out true.

Dawnguard is coming, a lot of its functions are now installed on the PC version of the game, and the patch which does so is being sent to the PS3.

Why would they add Vampire's Grip without Dawnguard?

I agree with this. I do think their policy maker for PR should revise preventing them from at least saying 'we are trying to bring it to both platforms'. At least then fans are a little more in the loop, and if something goes amiss, there's the minute consolation of 'at least they tried'.

[Glu Glu]

*facepalm*

Well that took a turn for the worst real fast, didn't it. What happened to being civil and mature?

I was prepared to let you have the last word, but really? Resorting to Ad Hominem because someone doesn't agree with you? Is that what this has come to? Get off your high horse and grow up. Also, i've said the word "invalid" about twice during my entire time on this forum (which you matched in that single comment, hey ho), so stop attempting to be funny. In your opinion the PR was bad, in my opinion it was not - and because I don't share your view, that means English is not my first language? What kind of warped, childlike and backward logic is that? I questioned whether that person's first language was English because he had bad English and misunderstood the patch notes, not because he didn't share my opinions, so nice try.

Pete Hines has already said on Twitter that info will be coming this very week regarding DG, and Gstaff has said that the PS3 and Xbox 360's 1.7 patch is being submitted this week if all goes to plan. The 1.7 patch itself confirms without a shadow of a doubt that DG is coming to PSN and Steam (as it fixes Dawnguard issues for all platforms not just Xbox 360), and the Steam CDR database provides yet more evidence of DG's inevitable arrival on other platforms. For the sake of the argument; let's pretend all of the above information didn't exist, and that we were actually left in the dark here; why on Earth would they have the 30 days of exclusivity if they were not planning to release it on other platforms? Are you seriously telling me that you couldn't put 2 and 2 together here?


So much irony.

Just using your very own phrases that have been read by myself throughout different threads, seems you can't handle it very well.
If you are going to be condescending to people you better be prepared to reap the rewards.
Hide behind the old "Oh, how mature" comments all you like, but it seems you lack from it yourself also.

So the answer to my question about a valid reason was?
Was the information given out the day the [censored] storm started?

You seem to be skirting round the issue like a Bethesda employee at the moment.

[Soku Nyorah]

Just using your very own phrases that have been read by myself throughout different threads, seems you can't handle it very well.
If you are going to be condescending to people you better be prepared to reap the rewards.
Hide behind the old "Oh, how mature" comments all you like, but it seems you lack from it yourself also.

So the answer to my question about a valid reason was?
Was the information given out the day the [censored] storm started?

You seem to be skirting round the issue like a Bethesda employee at the moment.

Which, like I said, i've used a grand total of 2-3 times (which you've matched, congratulations, you're now a condescending Dalek like me), out of over 100 posts and thousands of other words I use to construct a comment, enough with the hyperbole. How am I being condescending? I don't recall calling you a peasant or saying - even remotely implying - that you are insignificant and worthless compared to myself in any way shape or form. Were you so naive that you expected to insult someone and spread misinformation about them and not have people attempt to counter it? Did you come here expecting everyone to share your opinion? Also, how am I being immature? Did I insult you for absolutely no reason like you did to me? No. If you're going to spread nonsense like that about someone, at least be prepared to base if on actual fact, not something you pulled out of your backside.

Not the information from Beth themselves, that came mere days later. However, like I said, the patch notes for 1.7, the Dawnguard files included in 1.6, the Steam CDR database, even the fact that the DLC was a 'timed exclusive' to a platform in the first place is evidence enough. I've answered everything you said so far - stop lying.

[Melissa De Thomasis]

Which, like I said, i've used a grand total of 2-3 times, out of over 100 posts and thousands of words, enough with the hyperbole.

How am I being condescending? I don't recall calling you a peasant or saying you are insignificant in anyway. Were you so naive that you expected to insult someone and spread misinformation about them and not have people attempt to counter it? Did you come here expecting everyone to share your opinion?


Also, how am I being immature? Did I insult you for absolutely no reason like you did to me? No. If you're going to spread nonsense like that about someone, at least be prepared to base if on actual fact, not something you pulled out of your backside.

Not the information from Beth themselves, that came mere days later. However, like I said, the patch notes, the CDR, the files included in 1.6, even the fact that the DLC was a 'timed exclusive' to a platform in the first place is evidence enough. I've answered everything you said so far - stop lying.

As soon as you assumed everone would take the Microsoft Shilling you insulted me, or the bit where you think this form of buisness practise regarding delayed releases via bribes from companies is acceptable and therefore all should see it that way.
Some of us don't.
We find it abhorent and it should be stopped.

There was no proper release of information when it all kicked off and clues dug up by some of the more intelligent forum members as to the very existance of the DLC don't count.
Lets face it, Hot Coffee was always in GTA SanAndreas but that was never meant for the public either.

[luis ortiz]

Errr - why would we think we matter? Consumers matter how? What an empty threat it is to say on one hand "we are rabid for this product" and on the other "treat us with respect or we won't buy it."

Why would you think it is not going to be released for other platforms? That makes no sense - they are in this to make money.

I didn't say we did, I said we're being treated like we don't. Not mattering and being treated like you don't matter are two different things, no one minds that they don't matter, as a companies job, when they sell a product that relies on their fans being happy, is to make you feel like you do. But being blatantly treated like you don't is downright insulting to some people, and I understand why.
I never "threatened" to not buy the product. I fully intend to buy it the day it drops on Steam, that doesn't mean I'm suddenly happy and forgetful about the blatant disregard for showing some decency and respect.

I didn't say it wasn't going to be released for other platforms, in fact I said the opposite, what I said was it's easy to see why a lot of people seem to think they aren't getting it for their platform at all with the lack of a straight answer, the way game "journalists" are spinning the less than useful responses we are getting from Bethesdas PR and other users on other forums and this one yelling about how they "know" or don't think it is coming to all systems.

[Hope Greenhaw]

As soon as you assumed everone would take the Microsoft Shilling you insulted me, or the bit where you think this form of buisness practise regarding delayed releases via bribes from companies is acceptable and therefore all should see it that way.
Some of us don't.
We find it abhorent and it should be stopped.

That is the most arrogant thing I have ever read. When? When did I assume that everyone was OK with that? The fact that I am 'debating' with you right now is evidence otherwise. I even acknowledged the fact that we have different opinions in what was meant to be my last reply to you, remember, the one before you acted like a spoilt child? Instead of simply saying something is fact, back it up. As for that last part, like I said, did you honestly come here expecting everyone to share your opinions?

There was no proper release of information when it all kicked off and clues dug up by some of the more intelligent forum members as to the very existance of the DLC don't count.
Lets face it, Hot Coffee was always in GTA SanAndreas but that was never meant for the public either.

Of course it counts, it's conclusive evidence, it's even official evidence. The 1.6 patch files had things like Crossbows, new vampire animations and a few that are spoilers. Also, I like that little sly dig at me there. Why can't you construct a comment without attempting to insult?
Hot Coffee was removed simply because it was too explicit.

[Tyrone Haywood]

What is ticking me off about this that the, 360 is now getting more than 30 days of exclusivity on this. Bethesda have had 30+ days more development time than the 360 version to ensure Dawnguard is ready for release on other platforms, and it still wasn't released once the 30 day time limit was up.

I'm starting to face up to the fact that Bethesda simply are not skilled enough on the PS3, and are one of the only developers left to struggle with the platform, which I would find quite an embarrassment. I love the ES series but Bethesda are turning towards accepting cheap bribes from companies over their original PC fans. This is basically giving a middle finger to the people who have supported the ES series since the beginning.

The PR is a nightmare, you would have to be an idiot not to think people wouldn't start asking questions once the 30 days were up and thus should have had a statement prepared. Rarther than fobbing us off with "we will let you know by the end of the week" to buy to time while they run around try to put together a statement in a few days to cover up their huge mistakes.

The sort of business practice Microsoft endorses needs to stop, companies like Sony and Nintendo got to the top with skill and hard work. Microsoft bought themselves into the game right from the beginning by paying off companies for exclusive deals and with silly rules that if a game has more content on another platform they reserve the right to throw a hissy fit a refuse the game on their platform. Some companies don't accept this from MS, unfortunately Bethesda have been in their back pocket for a while now and unless we have a 360 we are penalized if we like TES and play it on any other platform.

[Red Sauce]

That is the most arrogant thing I have ever read. When? When did I assume that everyone was OK with that? The fact that I am 'debating' with you right now is evidence otherwise. I even acknowledged the fact that we have different opinions in what was meant to be my last reply to you, remember, the one before you acted like a spoilt child? Instead of simply saying something is fact, back it up. As for that last part, like I said, did you honestly come here expecting everyone to share your opinions?

I don't come here expecting everyone to share my opinions at all, that is what the whole point of a forum is, to debate.
I apologise for the seeminly personal attack but it is just the general feeling I get from your posts about your personality, take it with a pinch of salt.
I just get annoyed that you will defend them up to hilt when they blatantly took the wrong stance at the start of all this, and I agree with you that others have taken some tweets out of context also.
But they still shafted themeselves PR wise at the start.

Of course it counts, it's conclusive evidence, it's even official evidence. Also, I like that little sly dig at me there. Why can't you construct a comment without attempting to insult?
Hot Coffee was removed because it was explicit content.

There was no attack on you here whatsoever, it seems to be your turn to assume. See how easy it is?
Hot coffee, and many more things BTW, were disabled but still left in the actual game content. You see where I was pointing now with that statement?
Because someone found something deosn't mean [censored], in fact hasn't some things been removed in the 1.7 patch compared to the 1.6 patch?

[Colton Idonthavealastna]

What is ticking me off about this that the, 360 is now getting more than 30 days of exclusivity on this.

The FIGS version (European) was released later than the US version, I don't believe the exclusivity finishes for about 10 days for them.

Oh, and you all should stop with the personal attacks.

[Everardo Montano]

The FIGS version (European) was released later than the US version, I don't believe the exclusivity finishes for about 10 days for them.

Are you sure it would only be continued for them? Would it not also affect the US?

[Leah]

I don't come here expecting everyone to share my opinions at all, that is what the whole point of a forum is, to debate.
I apologise for the seeminly personal attack but it is just the general feeling I get from your posts about your personality, take it with a pinch of salt.
I just get annoyed that you will defend them up to hilt when they blatantly took the wrong stance at the start of all this, and I agree with you that others have taken some tweets out of context also.
But they still shafted themeselves PR wise at the start.

I had/have my own views on your personality too, but I didn't express them because it had no relevance. That's the point of my argument, going back to the post that was supposed to be my last; 'it's all a matter of perspective and opinions'. Your opinion is not fact, so it's not 'blatantly obvious' that this is bad business practice. Who is objectively right? There's probably no answer.

There was no attack on you here whatsoever, it seems to be your turn to assume. See how easy it is?

I beg to differ.

Hot coffee, and many more things BTW, were disabled but still left in the actual game content. You see where I was pointing now with that statement?
Because someone found something deosn't mean [censored], in fact hasn't some things been removed in the 1.7 patch compared to the 1.6 patch?

Those were disabled whilst the game itself was still in development, they were not added by a patch and then removed. They were design decisions, nothing more. Im not sure if it's been removed as of 1.7, but again, for the sake of the argument, let's pretend that there were no files included in the 1.6 update; you still have the fact that the DLC was timed exclusive to begin with, the CDR database evidence and the fact that 1.7 fixed Dawnguard issues for all platforms. People were saying the same thing you were when Dead Money came out for FO:NV on Xbox 360, people felt the same way as you. It was the exact same situation we find ourselves in now.

[Ashley Campos]

What people are not getting here is that us ps3/pc users are not upset because we have to wait, what most of us are upset over is that there's been no news or even an update saying it will be here *ball park figure* that's why we are fuming.

Maybe because they don't know? Its just as bad to announce something and then go back on that announcement if there is a hic up. That is why there is often silence in this regard when talking about release dates. Damned if you do, damned if you don't and considering, I'm not surprised they don't.

[Chris Duncan]

Are you sure it would only be continued for them? Would it not also affect the US?

No idea, but as Steam/PS3 will probably release in all countries at the same time it would seem a logical assumption. I don't see them splitting the release to US vs the rest of the world - goodness I hope not, just think of the chaos again on our forums.

[glot]

Well, idk much.....so I'll just keep playing pong while waiting for either the PS3 dlc or Elder Scrolls Online MMO to release, then I'll be a happy, productive person again

[Toby Green]

No idea, but as Steam/PS3 will probably release in all countries at the same time it would seem a logical assumption. I don't see them splitting the release to US vs the rest of the world - goodness I hope not, just think of the chaos again on our forums.

They do that all the time (PS3). The US will probably get it a week before the rest of the world.

[Syaza Ramali]

Those were disabled whilst the game itself was still in development, they were not added by a patch and then removed.

Weren't much patches that I can remember for it to fair and things can get added by accident also. Or intentions can change and they could still not release the DLC even though the patch contains the files.
Again this is up to Bethesda to tell us and keep us happy, to stop 20 odd threads (optimistic guess) of QQing. And I include myself among the QQers.

Im not sure if it's been removed as of 1.7, but again, for the sake of the argument, let's pretend that there were no files included in the 1.6 update; you still have the fact that the DLC was timed exclusive to begin with, the CDR database evidence and the fact that 1.7 fixed Dawnguard issues for all platforms. People were saying the same thing you were when Dead Money came out for FO:NV on Xbox 360, people felt the same way as you. It was the exact same situation we find ourselves in now.

The same [censored] will happen at the next DLCs as well if they don't sort out their PR.

And was the DLC really timed, did they just say that to buy some time?
Delaying the [censored]storm and possibly trying not to damage sales of other platforms in an underhand manner?
Did M$ say "keep the money, we don't give a [censored] if you keep it xbox eclusive, we won't take the cash back now anyway"?

All the above are just [censored], but until there was official word from Beth they would be just as valid as the last man's [censored].

It is up to Bethesda to supply the answers and none other.

[Melissa De Thomasis]

No idea, but as Steam/PS3 will probably release in all countries at the same time it would seem a logical assumption. I don't see them splitting the release to US vs the rest of the world - goodness I hope not, just think of the chaos again on our forums.

I doubt they would... hope not anyway. Then again, they did for Dawnguard on Xbox.

[Iain Lamb]

Hello, people. Just found this on CVG: http://www.computerandvideogames.com/360843/skyrim-17-update-now-live-on-steam/

In short. 1.7 is now live for PC, PS3 will be getting 1.6 and 1.7. Also, more on Dwanguard for PC and PS3 later this week.